Ultimarc A-Pac with 5k Potentiometers
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@caver01 I've spent a bit of time this evening playing with advmame video and reading a thread or too, which I notice you're involved in.
I found that if I bump video mode (in the TAB GUI) to 4.0 x (in my example 1024x1024) and set the resize to fractional, mixed or integer, and resize effect to filter, with scan2horz as the RGB effect, I can get something passable. (for Warlords that is) Scanlines, no curve.
Warlords is pretty much 1:1 in real life, its square on the screen. I can get that same result in RetroArch settings, but struggling with AdvMame. Maybe Advmame is "too" advanced for me! :-)
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@biglouieuk There might be a setting you can use to force aspect ratio. Been a while since I tried. It used to be the opposite--hard to get it to fill the screen!
I typically use the RGB triads effect with "mean" or "filter" enabled to smooth them out a bit. I always liked the triads more than the scanlines in AdvMAME as they resembled the big dot-pitch CRTs I grew up with.
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@caver01 I'll check out triads tomorrow and see how it looks. I've been digging in ADV MAME DOCS and while there is a bit in there, I haven't found something to force a 1/1 ratio as yet.
Once the Ultimarc optipac arrives and I can test it with the optical spinners I bought, it might mean I can drop advmame and head back to libretro anyway. Ive only been sticking with it as @1500points had done such great work on getting pots to work in advmame. (I've been lazy!)
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@caver01 I updated to the later version of advmame and the pots failed after updating the rc file
for advmame in the mame-advmame folder..Can I ask how you select which version of advmame the system uses? Is it editing the emulators.cfg? It still says ADVMAME 3.5 in the TAB gui when I try and switch that about.@1500points were you using 3.5 advmame for your tests?
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@biglouieuk You select the emulator used with the runcommand script. Basically, as the ROM launches, you have a few moments to press ENTER or whatever and a menu will popup. Here, you can set the default emulator that will launch all ROMs in this gamelist, or you can set a rom-specific emulator to be used for this ROM only. When you make a selection, the list of installed emulators appears, and here is where you can pick Advmame (3.x), Advmame1.4 and so on.
I use the Arcade ROM folder, so runcommand is crucial for proper operation. Every ROM in my list may come from a different ROMset (and so I have to keep track of that off-system) and many ROMs have a specific emulator selected. My default is lr-mame2003, but of course, all of my vector titles are setup with runcommand to launch AdvanceMAME.
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thanks @caver01 I can see exactly what you are explaining. I "think" warlords seems to work across all advmame variants with the same ROM set. Is that possible?
I'll do some testing, but I cant get pots working with 3.5, only in .94 at the moment. 3.5 seems to have an extra setting in the TAB GUI of Paddle Analog, as well as Paddle dec and Paddle Inc. 0.94 only has Paddle Dec and Inc
I also see a slight issue, as you have discussed above, where the bat doesnt go right the edge (in Warlords this time) and I also get a deadspot in the centre/zero of the pot, which I am trying to resolve!
Thx as always for your responses (Using triad on advmame at the moment to see how I like it.)
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@biglouieuk said in Ultimarc A-Pac with 5k Potentiometers:
I "think" warlords seems to work across all advmame variants with the same ROM set. Is that possible?
It is a coincidence. ROMsets are the collection of ROMs that work with a given version of MAME (or FBA in sets built for it). The .zip files for each title might change as MAME development changes. For example, early-on, MAME devs might have taken a shortcut for a given game, bypassing a chip's functionality here or there. Over time, they improved the emulation which sometimes required a new ROM dump to get all of the functionality working. For some games, new ROM chip dumps/scans became a requirement for the new code to work, which is why ROMset versions need to be in sync.
The point is that an early .zip file may not have the same number of files nor the same content of those files as a later .zip of the exact same game. Yet, in contradiction to this, other ROMs might be exactly the same as they were the first time they were created--the assumption being that every chip in the board was properly dumped/scanned the very first time.
That said, you might have a game that works in many versions of MAME because the ROM files for that title have not improved over the years. It's more common for sets that are closer together since there would be less programming changes to MAME in the interval (although some versions of MAME marked significant milestones of change). As convenient as this is in some cases, it is extremely frustrating in others--especially when casual users and beginners don't understand how it works. Folks will download a ROM .zip file for current MAME not realizing that versions matter thinking it must be the definitive copy of a given title. Or, they fall into the trap idea that the most recent must be the most accurate (and therefore the best). We are using some very old versions of MAME on the Pi so we can enjoy a "sweet spot" of performance versus accuracy, and ROMsets simply have to match what the emulator is expecting.
MAME is just a complicated project, given all of its variants and version numbers. But, once you grasp the basic idea, you begin to appreciate what the devs are doing with it and why the bleeding edge of emulation isn't always what we are after. Accuracy is not at all aligned with playability.
I'll do some testing, but I cant get pots working with 3.5, only in .94 at the moment.
You are hopefully making edits in the .rc files that match the version of AdvanceMAME you are using. They each require their own .rc files.
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@caver01 said in Ultimarc A-Pac with 5k Potentiometers:
You are hopefully making edits in the .rc files that match the version of AdvanceMAME you are using. They each require their own .rc files.
yup, got that. and now selecting version for each ROM. :)
Thanks for the description above about the ROM sets. All makes sense. I will hunt around for a later Warlords, not sure there is one. Pretty old and simple game perhaps?
3.5 seems to have a new setting that 0.94 doesn't have, in the TAB GUI....Paddle Analog <none> I wonder if that is the cause of the 3.5 issues...
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@biglouieuk said in Ultimarc A-Pac with 5k Potentiometers:
I will hunt around for a later Warlords, not sure there is one. Pretty old and simple game perhaps?
The fact that it is an older, simpler game might also mean that the ROM dumps were complete and haven't changed. The fact that they work in multiple versions of MAME supports this theory. It may not be worth your time to hunt for other versions, as you may find after downloading that they are the same anyway.
3.5 seems to have a new setting that 0.94 doesn't have, in the TAB GUI....Paddle Analog <none> I wonder if that is the cause of the 3.5 issues...
The GUI is always a bit misleading--the only thing you really control is the sensitivity settings which are a lot easier to edit there. You still need to assign controls through the .rc edits. I am surprised the same entries cannot be copied/transcribed from one .rc file to another to preserve functionality. I have successfully done that from .94 to 1.4 through more recent 3.x versions of the .rc files.
You might try launching the advm or advj utilities from their respective bin directories to test your pots that way. Maybe the different MAMEs are detecting a different device index?
Also, there have been certain developments in 3.x that are pi-specific. Certainly, the video seems to be better than it was in 1.2, 1.3, 1.4 versions. I have read other posts about performance challenges, but I have found the opposite case to be true--that 3.x works better/faster than earlier versions (Golden Tee variants prove this for me anyway). Performance is probably not an issue for Warlords, but video capabilities might be better.
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@caver01 said in Ultimarc A-Pac with 5k Potentiometers:
You might try launching the advm or advj utilities from their respective bin directories to test your pots that way. Maybe the different MAMEs are detecting a different device index?
trying this now, excellent idea!!
Same for both 0.94 AND 3.5 in advj...
I can see the feedback...So its ...Software?
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@biglouieuk Those utilities are intended to let you test raw analog input to see what indices they use and how you should map inputs in you .rc files. If the the index numbers are the same, I wonder if one MAME is maybe looking at PADDLE for that ROM and another looking at DIAL even though the ROM itself may not have changed. I dunno.
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@caver01 Yea, thats a good thought. I've just had a look. Both advj tools for 3.5 and 0.94 show JOY 1 x and y axis moving. So all good.
I'll add in some dial settings to the rc file, see if it has an effect. :O)
If you want to see the build, I have stuck some pictures up here http://www.ukvac.com/forum/topic360446_post1016264.html#1016264
and linked to this thread incase anyone else wants to understand the pots and MAME side of things..
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@biglouieuk said in Ultimarc A-Pac with 5k Potentiometers:
http://www.ukvac.com/forum/topic360446_post1016264.html#1016264
Cool project! I hope you are able to get the arcade background with the towers etc.
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haven't checked this thread in awhile.
I made the same changes in all .rc files, but i have been using the standard advancemame.haven't tried calibrating the pots, yet. the kids have been playing it a lot. Really popular around here now. Go Warlords!
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@1500points Did you load the background artwork? There is a great file for that online somewhere.
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@caver01 can you clarify what you mean by background art? Like a Retropie theme, you mean?
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@1500points No, I mean like the original game which had a semi-transparent mirror which superimposed the graphics over paper cardboard "castles". This cardboard artwork has been scanned and retouched such that you can load it as a background so the game looks like it is being played on original hardware. The .art file also has an overlay to tint the color of the players on screen. You definitely need the old (.106 and earlier) artwork file for Advancemame. Find that, download the .zip artwork file, and put it in the artwork folder that is referenced in your .rc file. Then, make sure background art and overlays are enabled.
Here is an example of me using the artwork file as a background for Asteroids. Similar art is available for games like Omega Race, Space Invaders etc.
The format can be a little tricky to modify, but most of the time I have been able to use these as-is, or what I like to do is darken them somewhat. To do that, you need to unzip then edit the .art file which is a simple text file with parameters that are pretty self-explanatory.
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Update on calibration of pots-
Plugged A-Pac into win10 pc, used the calibration steps found at https://www.ultimarc.com/a-pac.htmlIndeed it showed that one side of each movement wasn't going clear to edge of the test grid. Calibrating the pots in settings then fixed that on the PC. Applied the settings.
Plugged back into Raspberry Pi. Calibration fixes didn't come over.
One corner of each pot won't go clear to edge, but it doesn't affect gameplay.
The groovy game gear spinner does allow the shield to travel full range on warlords but wow that would be expensive to buy 4 turbo twists. -
@caver01 said in Ultimarc A-Pac with 5k Potentiometers:
@1500points No, I mean like the original game which had a semi-transparent mirror which superimposed the graphics over paper cardboard "castles". This cardboard artwork has been scanned and retouched such that you can load it as a background so the game looks like it is being played on original hardware. The .art file also has an overlay to tint the color of the players on screen. You definitely need the old (.106 and earlier) artwork file for Advancemame. Find that, download the .zip artwork file, and put it in the artwork folder that is referenced in your .rc file. Then, make sure background art and overlays are enabled.
Here is an example of me using the artwork file as a background for Asteroids. Similar art is available for games like Omega Race, Space Invaders etc.
The format can be a little tricky to modify, but most of the time I have been able to use these as-is, or what I like to do is darken them somewhat. To do that, you need to unzip then edit the .art file which is a simple text file with parameters that are pretty self-explanatory.
wow! never heard of that before. I'll look. Very cool.
@caver01 said in Ultimarc A-Pac with 5k Potentiometers:
@1500points No, I mean like the original game which had a semi-transparent mirror which superimposed the graphics over paper cardboard "castles". This cardboard artwork has been scanned and retouched such that you can load it as a background so the game looks like it is being played on original hardware. The .art file also has an overlay to tint the color of the players on screen. You definitely need the old (.106 and earlier) artwork file for Advancemame. Find that, download the .zip artwork file, and put it in the artwork folder that is referenced in your .rc file. Then, make sure background art and overlays are enabled.
Here is an example of me using the artwork file as a background for Asteroids. Similar art is available for games like Omega Race, Space Invaders etc.
The format can be a little tricky to modify, but most of the time I have been able to use these as-is, or what I like to do is darken them somewhat. To do that, you need to unzip then edit the .art file which is a simple text file with parameters that are pretty self-explanatory.
wow never heard of that. i'll check it out. very cool.
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@1500points Bummer. So the calibration in Windows stays with the driver and does not save to the board. Oh well, now we know.
Yes, the GGG spinners are expensive. I have two of them, and glad I do, but it was difficult to justify. It could be a good case for a set of DIY spinners. There are many tutorials, and even someone here who did it with a cheap little optical USB mouse. You can build encoder wheels using cardboard and an x-acto knife, but access to a 3-D printer would be more consistent.
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