Where to (legally) acquire content to play on RetroPie

dankcushions · 19 Feb 2018, 15:47

@markwkidd said in Where to (legally) acquire content to play on RetroPie:

@dankcushions said in Where to (legally) acquire content to play on RetroPie:

@matchaman the legal loophole is US law only. plus, like you say i think the legal implications for (US) users of said archived software aren't entirely clear.

It's not a loophole -- it's a deliberate and structured part of US copyright law. Per the DMCA the Librarian of Congress has consistently certified the exemption for software relying on obsolete hardware every three years since I believe 2006.

There's quite a bit written about this including its legal implications. Anyway.

IANAL but the part of the law i see on pages like this covers the archival and bypassing of copyright protection, not the distribution of said content to non-archivists. beyond that all i see is enthusiasts like us trying to work out what it does/doesn't mean, as this scene is wont to do.

in any case, the DMCA does not cover the world, right?

hooperre · 19 Feb 2018, 15:57

@dankcushions said in Where to (legally) acquire content to play on RetroPie:

@markwkidd said in Where to (legally) acquire content to play on RetroPie:

@dankcushions said in Where to (legally) acquire content to play on RetroPie:

@matchaman the legal loophole is US law only. plus, like you say i think the legal implications for (US) users of said archived software aren't entirely clear.

It's not a loophole -- it's a deliberate and structured part of US copyright law. Per the DMCA the Librarian of Congress has consistently certified the exemption for software relying on obsolete hardware every three years since I believe 2006.

There's quite a bit written about this including its legal implications. Anyway.

IANAL but the part of the law i see on pages like this covers the archival and bypassing of copyright protection, not the distribution of said content to non-archivists. beyond that all i see is enthusiasts like us trying to work out what it does/doesn't mean, as this scene is wont to do.

in any case, the DMCA does not cover the world, right?

This is really interesting stuff, honestly. From the US Copyright Office:

Computer programs and video games distributed in formats that have become obsolete and which require the original media or hardware as a condition of access.

Certainly seems like it would cover ROMs for systems embedded in RetroPie, but it's so poorly defined who really knows? Seems strange that, if given an exemption from DMCA, that the Internet Archive would take it and run with it and distribute things without consent from Congress and without a clear understanding of their exemption. Seems like someone getting out of jail and going to the bank next door and robbing it. Hard part was already done! Also, having that exemption would likely mean that Congress is well aware of their comings and goings and that there have likely been no complaints filed against them as they would likely be sensitive to any complaints they received. Again, like @dankcushions said, we're all left just grasping at straws though.

Fruitybit · 19 Feb 2018, 16:11

@rpieguy Thanks, got it going now. The trick was to add .rom to the es_system.cfg file:)

markwkidd · 19 Feb 2018, 20:08

@hooperre said in Where to (legally) acquire content to play on RetroPie:

Certainly seems like it would cover ROMs for systems embedded in RetroPie, but it's so poorly defined who really knows? Seems strange that, if given an exemption from DMCA, that the Internet Archive would take it and run with it and distribute things without consent from Congress and a clear understanding of their exemption. Seems like someone getting out of jail and going to the bank next door and robbing it. Hard part was already done! Also, having that exemption would likely mean that Congress is well aware of their comings and goings and that there have likely been no complaints filed against them as they would likely be sensitive to any complaints they received. Again, like @dankcushions said, we're all left just grasping at straws though.

Thanks! This sounds exactly like the exception that the Internet Archive worked on.

If this topic seems interesting to other people I'll dig up links to the original filings.

While there are ample primary sources about the archive.org DMCA exception there is little informed discussion of it online that I have ever found online.

Maybe that should be another thread, but -- without posting any links to ROMs of course -- I'd be glad to talk about it.

I've been informally approached to put together a presentation on intellectual property and emulation for game development conferences. At this point I'm not planning to do so, but this is a topic that has a lot of cultural significance as well as technology significance. Maybe someone else should put together a presentation! :)

Anyway, if someone starts that thread, I'll gladly join in.

mediamogul · 19 Feb 2018, 22:48

On the subject of the games themselves, I downloaded and played 'Ultimate PONG', 'Donkey Kong Arcade' and 'Yogi's Frustration'. 'Ultimate PONG' is very straight-forward and a PONG package that's hard to beat. I thought I'd miss the analog control found in Atari's own 'Video Olympics'/'PONG Sports', but it feels like everything was tailored to the digital controls for this and it plays very smoothly as a result.

'Donkey Kong Arcade' is very impressive. We've all heard the rumors that Coleco intentionally sabotaged their own version of 'Donkey Kong' for the Intellivision in an effort to sell more Colecovisions. I've never been fully convinced of that, but this version does prove that they certainly didn't give it their all, regardless of their motives. 'Donkey Kong Arcade' looks and plays beautifully and captures the one quality you should look for in any DK port, the inability to put it down.

'Yogi's Frustration' apparently started off it's life as a loose adaptation of the Charlie Chaplin film 'Modern Times', one of the first films to have synchronized sound. It's a great commentary on the dehumanizing effect technology can have on mankind, yet still manages to be one of his funniest films. The fact that the Tramp says absolutely nothing in his first "talkie" alone makes me laugh. 'Yogi's Frustration' would have been the second video game adaptation of a silent movie, alongside Activision's 'Keystone Kapers' which was based on the short film series, 'Keystone Cops'. Mattel decided to attach Yogi and Booboo to sell more copies and after the game tested poorly, it was discovered that while the game play itself was well received, it was actually Yogi and Booboo who were testing poorly. This particular game is so unique, I feel like I need more time with it than what I was able to spend today. However, I can say that I do enjoy playing it and that already passes a base-level requirement that all too many games haven't.

xFlesk · 21 Feb 2018, 21:39

i think this is a right thread ;)
here you have a great free new game for NES (english and polish language)

http://www.mteegfx.com/grunio

cheers

SgtJimmyRustles · 22 Feb 2018, 15:17

@mediamogul

Do you have a link to images showing "Donky Kong Arcade"?

mediamogul · 22 Feb 2018, 15:25

@sgtjimmyrustles

Yessir. Pictures and a comparison video trailer can be found here, along with the ROM.

SgtJimmyRustles · 22 Feb 2018, 17:15

@mediamogul

Yeah, that's much better than what was released.

Appreciate the link.

rpieguy · 23 Feb 2018, 00:08

@sgtjimmyrustles Here's an updated version of Intellivision DK Arcade, also posted earlier in this thread. It has both Japanese and North American modes of the game and bug fixes. http://www.carlmuellerjr.com/2016/12/d1k-arcade-rom-download-page-dk-arcade.html

kikinaak · 26 Feb 2018, 01:03

The dreamcast has a homebrew dev scene that is still active to this day. There's several games that can be had for free legally. Unfortunately a lot of the sites that host only the homebrew have gone down, and the only one I can find thats still up also hosts commercial games. so I cant post the link. But I found them pretty quick via google.

markwkidd · 26 Feb 2018, 04:05

@kikinaak said in Where to (legally) acquire content to play on RetroPie:

The dreamcast has a homebrew dev scene that is still active to this day. There's several games that can be had for free legally. Unfortunately a lot of the sites that host only the homebrew have gone down, and the only one I can find thats still up also hosts commercial games. so I cant post the link. But I found them pretty quick via google.

You can try the internet archive wayback machine and search for those old Dreamcast sites. It often, but not always, archives download links in addition to web pages.

Another thing to do is go to a page like the one with the updated DK Arcade. Then tell the Wayback Machine to manually archive it as it is today. Then tell the archive to manually archive the ROM download. That way DK Arcade has a good change of remaining available even after this site goes down.

SgtJimmyRustles · 16 Mar 2018, 22:26

Heads up, I found the Sega Genesis bundle back for $10.

https://www.fanatical.com/en/bundle/sega-megadrive-and-genesis-classics-bundle?utm_source=Fanatical+Newsletter&utm_campaign=2e552441c8-SEGAd_03_16_2018&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_3437eaaeba-2e552441c8-431067757&mc_cid=2e552441c8&mc_eid=a56592a707

hooperre · 16 Mar 2018, 22:31

@sgtjimmyrustles Thanks! Got it.

SgtJimmyRustles · 17 Mar 2018, 14:53

@hooperre

No problem!

hooperre · 17 Mar 2018, 14:58

I'm gonna shotgun this out to everyone for feedback. I don't want to start my own thread, but at the same time don't want to hijack this thread.

I'm a business owner in the States and would like to provide my patrons with a throwback arcade style system to play with until I'm ready for them. I have acquired a bunch of ROMs from places like Steam and freeware ROMs so I assume it would be 'legal' for me to have them on a system as long as I'm not collecting money from it for plays or anything? Just thought it would be fun to share my love for games and nostalgia with patrons. I think it will be a hit.

markwkidd · 17 Mar 2018, 15:00

@hooperre said in Where to (legally) acquire content to play on RetroPie:

I'm gonna shotgun this out to everyone for feedback. I don't want to start my own thread, but at the same time don't want to hijack this thread.

I'm a business owner in the States and would like to provide my patrons with a throwback arcade style system to play with until I'm ready for them. I have acquired a bunch of ROMs from places like Steam and freeware ROMs so I assume it would be 'legal' for me to have them on a system as long as I'm not collecting money from it for plays or anything? Just thought it would be fun to share my love for games and nostalgia with patrons. I think it will be a hit.

Edit: more thorough answers below.

herb_fargus · 17 Mar 2018, 15:09

@hooperre none of us are lawyers, so in order to get a definitive answer in your country you'd have to speak with a lawyer there.

I had a dentist that had a RoboCop cab on Freeplay, and another one that had an Xbox. Where the legality of it all lies idk, same idea as showing movies, the technicalilty may deem it illegal but is rarely enforced for such small venues

dankcushions · 17 Mar 2018, 15:27

@hooperre said in Where to (legally) acquire content to play on RetroPie:

I'm gonna shotgun this out to everyone for feedback. I don't want to start my own thread, but at the same time don't want to hijack this thread.

I'm a business owner in the States and would like to provide my patrons with a throwback arcade style system to play with until I'm ready for them. I have acquired a bunch of ROMs from places like Steam and freeware ROMs so I assume it would be 'legal' for me to have them on a system as long as I'm not collecting money from it for plays or anything? Just thought it would be fun to share my love for games and nostalgia with patrons. I think it will be a hit.

i think technically it's illegal: https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2013/07/why-nintendo-can-legally-shut-down-any-smash-bros-tournament-it-wants/

mediamogul · 17 Mar 2018, 15:43

@hooperre

Many people ask a similar question, looking to find whether they're in the right or wrong. What most don't consider is that even if you're in the right, anything can be taken to court if an offended party feels otherwise. In those cases, the winner is usually whoever has the deeper pockets. Having purchased the games legitimately really only affords you a defense should it ever go to court, in which case it would need to be examined whether or not the license covers public use, or if it's transferable to other methods of playback. That being said, legal action would be a worse case scenario and a cease and desist order would likely come as an initial response to which you could simply abide and hopefully be done with it. Personally, I would adhere to the age-old advice of "Don't start nothin', won't be nothin'".