Getting the best N64 experience on a Pi 4
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@roslof nice work!
If you lean towards performance based gameplay: try switching off Fram Buffer Emulation. This will give a big performance boost. I haven't noticed different graphics on my pi4 apart from a few ingame tv monitors which no longer show an image in that ingame tv monitor
There is however one issue: you can only use ntsc (us) roms, since there is an issue with alignment of objects on pal (eu) roms with Framebuffer Emulation off. This one is already acknowledged by the developer of gliden64 and will probably fixed a near future release.
So on my system i use default settings + threaded renderer on + Frame Buffer Emulation off on all roms. Except for a few roms wich are not available in the us version where i have fb emu enabled
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@akamming said in Getting the best N64 experience on a Pi 4:
try switching off fb emulation
That's Frame Buffer Emulation for any newbies (like myself) that aren't familiar with abbreviations
FYI ;)
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@akamming What is Threaded Renderer listed as please? Struggling to see it in the Options...
Edit: Ahhh, that is an lr-mupenplus-next Option I see.
@roslof This is a great resource. I agree with it, in as much as I've checked it against my system so far. Aside from on a few points:
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Yoshi's Story on Rice is just too glitchy for me, I'm using lr-mupen64plus even if that is slightly jumpy at scrolling sometimes. I can't cope with my eggs being black squares.
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WaveRace 64 - if I use lr-mupen64plus, the bottom of my screen gets cut off, there is a black bar at the bottom. I've been using GLideN64-highres, which isn't full-screen but does seem to run fine.
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on Killer Instinct Gold, as @quicksilver mentioned above - if you use mupen64plus-gliden64 and let the game run for a fight or two, the game then begins to run fine and will be okay for the rest of the session.
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if anyone wants to play Mystical Ninja Starring Goeman, then mupen64plus-gles2rice is the emulator to use, and make sure you use the US ROM, as there is something awry with the European version.
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@ReadyPlayaWon you're right, i edited my post for better readability. (i'm also a newbie btw... ;-) )
@AdamBeGood That's the one i mean. There 's also a similar option in Mupen64plus in the mupen64plus.cfg file: "ThreadVideo=On|Off", which is default "on". i think this is the same, but i never switched it off to find out, so i'm not 100% sure..
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Overclocking ISP and h264 frequency is unnecessary and confusing to newbies. It won't hurt anything but these are used for the image sensor pipeline (aka camera) and for video decoding. They aren't used at all in emulation.
Second, many games will be broken with framebuffer emulation turned off. I don't recommend turning it off (it's on by default for a reason). The performance boost isn't worth it if the game doesn't function properly.
Threaded rendering should be left on, I can't think of a case where turning it off would be beneficial (except maybe input latency).
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@akamming said in Getting the best N64 experience on a Pi 4:
try switching off Fram Buffer Emulation.
Thanks @akamming! Yes, from what I can tell, the default setting after a clean install has Frame Buffer Emulation set to False. You may note in the list a few games set to True as an override.
If I'm mistaken, I'll add a comment to the top of the override column so folks can set that as default.
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@roslof FBE is definitely set to true by default. it is needed for so many games to function correctly.
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@dankcushions said in Getting the best N64 experience on a Pi 4:
@roslof FBE is definitely set to true by default. it is needed for so many games to function correctly.
Thank you @dankcushions
Perfect. I'll make the note in the list. -
@quicksilver said in Getting the best N64 experience on a Pi 4:
Overclocking ISP and h264 frequency is unnecessary and confusing to newbies. It won't hurt anything but these are used for the image sensor pipeline (aka camera) and for video decoding. They aren't used at all in emulation.
Good idea. I edited my post and removed the two lines.
Second, many games will be broken with framebuffer emulation turned off. I don't recommend turning it off (it's on by default for a reason). The performance boost isn't worth it if the game doesn't function properly.
From testing about 70 games, the number that require Frame Buffer Emulation seems to be very low. Seems better as an override in this case. Do you know if it affects PAL games more than NTSC? My optimized set is NTSC, and only PAL is used if there is no NTSC equivalent.
Threaded rendering should be left on, I can't think of a case where turning it off would be beneficial (except maybe input latency).
This may again be because I'm primarily using a custom NTSC ROMset. Performance seems to be a factor here. You have me thinking that I should retest the games for those emulators with the option on and see if the FPS Delta is significant.
@quicksilver I know you've done your homework and have helped in several threads. Appreciate your help here.
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@roslof yes i'm 100% sure fb emulation causes alignment issues on pal games, Cause i logged an issue at the gliden64 repository and this was the answer of the developer:
N64 has Video Interface (VI) subsystem, which maps digital image to TV screen. VI controls, how the image will be placed on screen. For example, your MK64 shots. I'm sure it is PAL version of the game. It has black bars on top and bottom because PAL has more horizontal lines than NTSC. VI adds vertical offset when it maps image to screen. Emulation of VI is part of FB emulation.In other words if you switch off fb emulation you miss an essential capability to display the video correctly for pal.
Details can be found here
In my experience it works fine on ntsc.
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@akamming thanks again. Will make the adjustments.
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@AdamBeGood said in Getting the best N64 experience on a Pi 4:
Yoshi's Story on Rice is just too glitchy for me, I'm using lr-mupen64plus even if that is slightly jumpy at scrolling sometimes. I can't cope with my eggs being black squares.
I changed the recommendation to lr-mupen64plus but added notes about the Rice option. Thank you!
WaveRace 64 - if I use lr-mupen64plus, the bottom of my screen gets cut off, there is a black bar at the bottom. I've been using GLideN64-highres, which isn't full-screen but does seem to run fine.
Changed recommendation to GLideN64-highres. Thanks here too,
on Killer Instinct Gold, as @quicksilver mentioned above - if you use mupen64plus-gliden64 and let the game run for a fight or two, the game then begins to run fine and will be okay for the rest of the session.
Changed to GLideN64 and credited accordingly.
if anyone wants to play Mystical Ninja Starring Goeman, then mupen64plus-gles2rice is the emulator to use, and make sure you use the US ROM, as there is something awry with the European version.
Added this test and credited. Thank you!
Getting lots of good advice for the group.
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@roslof said in Getting the best N64 experience on a Pi 4:
...Maybe this can help Pi4B owners get rolling more quickly, as it takes a long time to find recommended emulators for ~400 games.
I run perfect dark in 16:9 480x360 in Lr-Mupen64plus-next with very similar overclock settings (see my sig). Several games will run in Lr-Mupen64Plus-next at 320x240 with MSAA set to 2 with very little performance drop.
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@George-Spiggott said in Getting the best N64 experience on a Pi 4:
@roslof said in Getting the best N64 experience on a Pi 4:
...Maybe this can help Pi4B owners get rolling more quickly, as it takes a long time to find recommended emulators for ~400 games.
I run perfect dark in 16:9 480x360 in Lr-Mupen64plus-next with very similar overclock settings (see my sig). Several games will run in Lr-Mupen64Plus-next at 320x240 with MSAA set to 2 with very little performance drop.
What is MSAA? I'm not familiar with it. I don't suppose it fixes the Spycam parts of Perfect Dark, those are a bit janky on my playthroughs so far.
I guess I'll have a play around.
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@AdamBeGood (multi sample) Anti aliasing. SotE looks really good with it.
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@AdamBeGood the camspy should work just fine using mupen64plus-gliden64 with default settings on the pi 4. It won't work at all on previous pi models.
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@quicksilver Yep, you are right. I am not sure what emulator I was using before then...
That part even seems okay on highres, but there is a bit of slowdown generally (Villa level isn't great). Shame, as it seems quite close to being able to run fine and it looks better than the normal lr-mupen64plus.
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@quicksilver said in Getting the best N64 experience on a Pi 4:
change screen update setting to 7 and it will get rid of the strange "jitter" issue that gles2rice has on the pi 4
Awesome ! it works .. thanks very much :)
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@roslof First of all : thank you. This list was much needed.
But, for some reason, even if I have very similar settings (OC : arm:2000, core:550, v3b:800, skipframe=true, framebuffer=false, screen update=7), but I do not get the same results... :(
For example : when playing Excitebike 64 with Rice, not only is the screen window super small, but the game still stutters a lot. For Super Smash Brothers, Gliden make it fast, but the sounds is super crackling (at each sounds peaks)...
Anything anyone could see that I would be missing?
Any help or references will be appreciated. I am new to Retropie with Pi 4 and pretty discouraged with N64 emulation (my favorite console from my childhood)...
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@Nakynaw would you create a paste.bin of your settings from:
/opt/retropie/configs/n64/mupen64plus.cfg
/opt/retropie/configs/n64/emulators.cfgI'll compare yours with mine and share the delta with you.
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