[solved] Hydro Thunder (Dreamcast / Flycast)

[sleve_mcdichael]

Re: https://retropie.org.uk/forum/topic/32416/hydro-thunder-flycast-chd-file-ubuntu-focal-fossa

...

Edit: solved! TL;DR: just delete the BIOS files dc_flash.bin and/or dc_nvmem.bin if they exist. These files are generated by the emulators and do not need provided by the user. I think dc_flash.bin should be removed from the online docs.

...

I am having the same issue with Hydro Thunder in lr-flycast as described in this other thread. I have tried several different versions, all experience the same issue where after the "Dreamcast" startup animation fades into the Sega logo, the screen goes black and stays black, while the FPS counter dips to around 9.9. When I open up the RGUI menu it goes back up to 60 and then tanks back down to 9.9 when I close it again.

@rott42 and @mitu, you have both said it is working for you. Can you give me any more info about how you've got it working or what your setup is and which versions you have used?

I do see that topic is in re: Ubuntu, not Raspberry Pi. Are you also? I'm on different hardware, but my symptoms are the same.

RPi4, official power supply, not overclocked. HDMI into 720p TV.

RetroPie 4.8, RetroArch 1.10.0, lr-flycast 0.1 4c293f3. The only changes I've made to flycast (reicast) core options are per-content VMUs (VMU A1) and NAOMI service buttons (enabled).

I have tried three different source files:

234875423624e7db40b36805fd8c781d  Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A).7z
4379feac8c28dd15a81ae7dec46f39e1  Hydro Thunder v1.002 (1999)(Midway)(US)[!].zip
740c2401979a277d0376679d314a3009  Hydro Thunder v1.020 (1999)(Midway)(US)[!].zip

They all unzip to gdi. I have also tried converting them to chd on my RPi4 with chdman createcd -i <gdi> -o <chd> but I understand it's probably not going to work if the source gdi doesn't, first (the chd files I did make behaved exactly the same as their sources did: Dreamcast, Sega, black screen, ~10 frames.)

(Edit: my bios):

e10c53c2f8b90bab96ead2d368858623  dc_boot.bin
0a93f7940c455905bea6e392dfde92a4  dc_flash.bin

Here is the full list of files once they are unzipped:

'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A)/':
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A).gdi'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 01).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 02).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 03).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 04).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 05).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 06).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 07).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 08).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 09).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 10).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 11).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 12).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 13).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 14).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 15).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 16).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 17).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 18).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 19).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 20).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 21).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 22).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 23).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 24).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 25).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 26).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 27).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 28).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 29).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 30).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 31).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 32).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 33).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 34).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 35).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 36).bin'
'Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A) (Track 37).bin'

'Hydro Thunder v1.002 (1999)(Midway)(US)[!]/':
'Hydro Thunder v1.002 (1999)(Midway)(US)[!].gdi'
track01.bin
track02.raw
track03.bin
track04.raw
track05.raw
track06.raw
track07.raw
track08.raw
track09.raw
track10.raw
track11.raw
track12.raw
track13.raw
track14.raw
track15.raw
track16.raw
track17.raw
track18.raw
track19.raw
track20.raw
track21.raw
track22.raw
track23.raw
track24.raw
track25.raw
track26.raw
track27.raw
track28.raw
track29.raw
track30.raw
track31.raw
track32.raw
track33.raw
track34.raw
track35.raw
track36.raw
track37.bin

'Hydro Thunder v1.020 (1999)(Midway)(US)[!]/':
'Hydro Thunder v1.020 (1999)(Midway)(US)[!].gdi'
track01.bin
track02.raw
track03.bin
track04.raw
track05.raw
track06.raw
track07.raw
track08.raw
track09.raw
track10.raw
track11.raw
track12.raw
track13.raw
track14.raw
track15.raw
track16.raw
track17.raw
track18.raw
track19.raw
track20.raw
track21.raw
track22.raw
track23.raw
track24.raw
track25.raw
track26.raw
track27.raw
track28.raw
track29.raw
track30.raw
track31.raw
track32.raw
track33.raw
track34.raw
track35.raw
track36.raw
track37.bin

Do any of these look familiar? Is there another version I should use? I have seen a couple more out there in the wild. Can you help me identify one that works?

[rott42]

@sleve_mcdichael Well, I have for sure a different GDI with other file names for the BIN tracks . I cannot share the source here of course, but I can tell you it's out there. Good luck. I actually, removed this game form my setup cause I did'nt like it much.

[sleve_mcdichael]

edit: rott42 & mitu you can disregard, see next post.

I understand you cannot tell me where you got it and I wouldn't ask you to. However, can you tell me anything? What the filename was, what the unzipped contents looked like? You don't have it anymore so I guess you can't just say what the hash is...maybe @mitu still has it and could check?

I've now tried all of the following, without success:

50943bb1        Hydro Thunder (Europe).7z
a61daf68        Hydro Thunder (USA).7z
094d5da0        Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A).7z
8ee30d0a        Hydro Thunder v1.002 (1999)(Midway)(US)[!].zip
bf0576ab        Hydro Thunder v1.009 (1999)(Midway)(PAL)[!].zip
1f541b29        Hydro Thunder v1.020 (1999)(Midway)(NTSC)(US)[!].zip
3f33e4e3        Hydro Thunder v1.020 (1999)(Midway)(US)[!].zip

The only difference between any of them is that the PAL/EU versions boot with a blue BIOS logo while the NTSC/US versions have a red logo.

As proof-of-concept I DL'ed another game, of which I already had a working chd from other source: Crazy Taxi (USA).7z. The extracted gdi, and the chd I made from it both played without issues.

Then I tried something else. I put a PlayStation chd in the Dreamcast folder and tried to load it. Here something different happened: first, the "Dreamcast" logo came up as a static image instead of the animation, and then it faded out, and instead of going to a black screen it just loaded the BIOS menu where you can select from "play," "file," "music," or "settings."

I'm running out of ideas. I can try Redream, I suppose. But two have said it works in Flycast and I'd like to stick with RA if that is possible.

Is there anything else that needs to be done besides "get the right rom, get the right BIOS, and load it in Flycast with the default options"? Core options, video modes, anything?

[sleve_mcdichael]

Yoooo, I don't know what happened, but it's working now? With at least two of these different versions.

I had given up. I installed Redream. It worked. I tried a different version. It worked. I converted them to CHDs. They worked.

On a whim, I decided I'd look at the verbose log from Flycast. So I loaded it up, fully expecting it to do the back screen, and wouldn't ya know it the damn thing started up, like I'm some sort of crazy person. Running the game at around 30 fps. I put a couple of the other versions in and they worked too.

I don't know what's going on, Redream doesn't install any dependencies or anything. I was exploring the core options a bit but I didn't leave anything changed. Several times when testing I did delete the VMU save files that were generated in the BIOS and roms folders (I did enable the option to save A1 in roms -- B1-D1 are still saved in BIOS -- but that was days ago.) I suppose they might have been...corrupted or something? But again, I've deleted them several times and it only suddenly started working this evening.

I'm sure I did something different. I just don't know what. I hate to be that guy who comes in with a problem and then goes "I don't know what it was or what I did but I fixed it," but it is what it is.

In any case, I guess I have Redream installed now, too. The screen tears real bad in Crazy Taxi in Redream, but I just might use it for Hydro Thunder after all as that one looks a lot sharper and might run a little smoother, too. Still had a little screen tearing but not as bad, from the few minutes I've played them.

[testudo]

@sleve_mcdichael

I am experiencing the same issue you did with HT on an Ubuntu setup. After trying multiple different GDI/CHD versions of the game I gave up. I just installed Redream and got each of them to work. But, I did not have the same luck as you when reverting to lr-Flycast. I knew it was a shot in the dark, but none of the versions worked.

If it is not a violation of forum policy, can you advise which version(s) you listed above ended up working on lr-Flycast?

[sleve_mcdichael]

@testudo I am currently using a CHD made from:

094d5da0        Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A).7z

The other working one was:

3f33e4e3        Hydro Thunder v1.020 (1999)(Midway)(US)[!].zip

...and I didn't try it, but this third one is identical to the second, as reported by diff, except for the filename of the .gdi file contained within (the .gdi itself is identical in content, as well -- only the name differs):

1f541b29        Hydro Thunder v1.020 (1999)(Midway)(NTSC)(US)[!].zip

I'm kinda assuming, then, that they all work, and whatever this is that is happening is unrelated to the rom version used.

I wish I could remember exactly what I did, to help narrow down what changed. I did "update RetroPie setup script" before I installed Redream (actually I installed it, remembered, updated the script, and then installed it again.) However, before I did that, it had last been updated only nine days prior, and the Redream script hasn't been edited for over a month, so I don't think that was it: https://github.com/RetroPie/RetroPie-Setup/commits/master/scriptmodules/emulators/redream.sh

If I recall anything else, I'll let you know.

[testudo]

@sleve_mcdichael said in Hydro Thunder (Dreamcast / Flycast):

Hydro Thunder (USA) (Rev A).7z

Much obliged. I'll see if I can find the same hash versions and give them a try. I'm running on a x86, so Redream is only a standalone option and not integrated into RP.

[sleve_mcdichael]

@testudo said in Hydro Thunder (Dreamcast / Flycast):

I'm running on a x86, so Redream is only a standalone option and not integrated into RP.

I wonder why. Does this work?

https://raw.githubusercontent.com/s1eve-mcdichae1/RetroPie-Setup/redream-x86/scriptmodules/emulators/redream.sh

(I'm not sure if the "x86_64" download is universal, or only for 64-bit systems. Is yours? Is this what you're using?)

[testudo]

@sleve_mcdichael said in Hydro Thunder (Dreamcast / Flycast):

@testudo said in Hydro Thunder (Dreamcast / Flycast):

I'm running on a x86, so Redream is only a standalone option and not integrated into RP.

I wonder why. Does this work?

https://raw.githubusercontent.com/s1eve-mcdichae1/RetroPie-Setup/redream-x86/scriptmodules/emulators/redream.sh

(I'm not sure if the "x86_64" download is universal, or only for 64-bit systems. Is yours? Is this what you're using?)

I replaced the redream scriptmodule with x_86 version you linked and success! My option to add Redream was red in the Experimental emulator list and replacing the script fixed that.

Thanks for sharing your experience the help.

[sleve_mcdichael]

@testudo said in Hydro Thunder (Dreamcast / Flycast):

I replaced the redream scriptmodule with x_86 version you linked and success! My option to add Redream was red in the Experimental emulator list and replacing the script fixed that.

Great! It looks like the x86 version is 64-bit specifically, so I changed it just a little more:

https://github.com/RetroPie/RetroPie-Setup/pull/3521

[sleve_mcdichael]

hate to be that guy who comes in with a problem and then goes "I don't know what it was or what I did but I fixed it," but it is what it is.

So, I think I figured out what I did.

TL;DR: just delete the BIOS files dc_flash.bin and/or dc_nvmem.bin if they exist. These files are generated by the emulators and do not need provided by the user. I think dc_flash.bin should be removed from the online docs.

"@SM, what have you been up to lately?"

Revisiting this because I encountered it again when putting some Dreamcast onto a new setup *(well, back onto my old setup anyway, that had prior been scrubbed of all traces, until later when I got a USB stick for some extra storage and decided to put them back on now that I could afford the space. Anyway...)

Using lr-flycast I would get the same black-screen behavior in Hydro Thunder, and then also SF Rush 2049 would not load but would boot straight to the BIOS menu instead.

Re: BIOS, I'm using the same World dc_boot.bin and USA dc_flash.bin as noted in posts above, (checksums match the docs, etc.) Additional, there is another file present dc_nvmem.bin which I did not provide, but was created automatically when it doesn't exist.

I also have an older backup from back when it "magically worked" (after trying Redream the first time), which includes another version this file.

When no dc_nvmem.bin exists, or after it makes one automatically, the games don't work. But when I apply the backup dc_nvmem.bin, then they do begin working.

...

Testing various iterations to see what works or not. Some observations. So far these are 100% reproducible:

• After playing lr-flycast, dc_nvmem.bin is updated, or is created if not exist.

• After playing redream, dc_flash.bin instead is updated, or is created if not exist.

• With neither file present, HT (Hydro Thunder) works in lr-flycast and produce a "good" dc_nvmem.bin on exit.

lr-flycast only writes the nvmem but clearly it does reads from dc_flash if exist, because:

• With just the docs version file dc_flash.bin 0a93f... present, HT not work in flycast and produce a "bad" dc_nvmem.bin on exit.

• With just an "updated" (by running redream once) dc_flash.bin present, HT works in flycast and produce a "good" dc_nvmem.bin on exit.

If dc_nvmem exist, it seem to override dc_flash, because:

• A "bad" dc_nvmem.bin, with or without any dc_flash.bin (docs or modified), HT not work and produce a "bad" nvmem.

• A "good" dc_nvmem.bin, with or without any dc_flash.bin (docs or modified), HT works and produce a "good" nvmem.

After playing redream, the new/updated dc_flash.bin can be copied as a "good" dc_nvmem.bin by which will HT works in flycast.

... so the solution seems to be, delete both dc_flash.bin, dc_nvmem.bin if they exist then play the game once, and then...then do I even need a flash.bin after that, or am I good with just the new nvmem? It seems to work at this point, whether I add back the documented flash.bin file afterwards, or not. No, just delete them and play. The emulator that you use will generate the file that it needs and you don't need to do anything else. You just need the boot BIOS if you want, but even that is optional.

...

Digging further:

Both redream and flycast say they want the boot bios (redream calls it optional), but neither mention the flash/nvmem one at all. Reicast is dead in the water and I can't find any information regarding BIOS requirements at all, there.

https://redream.io/help#bios

https://docs.libretro.com/library/flycast/#bios

https://github.com/reicast/reicast-emulator.git

...

Flycast do also say the boot BIOS is optional, if you look at the stand-alone source:

https://github.com/TheArcadeStriker/flycast-wiki/wiki/Getting-started-with-Flycast#requisites-and-important-files

• "A Dreamcast BIOS file is optional but NAOMI and Atomiswave BIOS files are required."

Here, it also calls out that you specifically don't need the dc_nvmem.bin file unless you are importing your own setup:

https://github.com/TheArcadeStriker/flycast-wiki/wiki/Getting-started-with-Flycast#dreamcast-main-files

• "...a table of Dreamcast files, all of which (except dc_boot.bin) are generated and used by the emulator (so, for example, it is recommended that you only have a dc_boot.bin file inside if you are starting, unless you are importing your stuff from another setup)"

...

As shown, user-provide dc_flash.bin is not require and in some cases, can even prevent games from working.

Does anyone know source for requiring it in the first place?

If other user can confirm these behavior and interpretations, I propose that dc_flash.bin removed from the docs, and note also that dc_boot.bin optional but not required.