Macintosh (Basilisk II) 8-bit Color

spud11

@meneer-jansen @FranceMSR I added the oldgames image (disk02.imgon which POP2 appears) to the emulators.cfg, so that I could start up POP2 from that ready made disk I'm using (and which I suspect most people are using).

That works too, so I suspect the difference in reliability is actually something to do with the installation of the MacOS. Starting from scratch using @FranceMSR's guide seems to be the most reliable way of getting POP2 working avoiding the Black Screen of Death.

Also, I switched the Pi off overnight and started it up again this morning. That seems to have removed the floppy disk issue I was having. When I started up Basilisk this morning, it rebuilt the Mac emulator on startup, so all is good at that end.

I'm still not sure, however, how to get POP2 to start automatically from the retropie/emulationstation menu. I'm still having to click once or twice in the MacOS to start POP2 manually after the emulator starts.

spud11

@meneer-jansen There are in fact quite a few differences in the basiliskii.cfg between the 2 processes of setup:

Retropie Italia's version is:

rom /home/pi/RetroPie/roms/macintosh/color_classic.rom
#disk /home/pi/RetroPie/roms/macintosh/DiskTools_MacOS8.image
#disk /home/pi/RetroPie/roms/macintosh/InstallationDisk
disk /home/pi/RetroPie/roms/macintosh/MacOS753.img
disk /home/pi/RetroPie/roms/macintosh/Stuff-it_Expander55.dsk
extfs /home/pi/RetroPie/roms/macintosh

displaycolordepth 8
seriala /dev/ttyS0
serialb /dev/ttyS1
udptunnel false
udpport 6066
bootdrive 0
bootdriver 0
ramsize 33554432
frameskip 0
modelid 5
cpu 4
fpu true
nocdrom false
nosound false
noclipconversion false
nogui false
jit false
jitfpu false
jitdebug false
jitcachesize 0
jitlazyflush false
jitinline false
keyboardtype 5
keycodes false
mousewheelmode 1
mousewheellines 3
dsp /dev/dsp
mixer /dev/mixer
ignoresegv true
idlewait true

The "normal" Retropie version is as follows:

displaycolordepth 8
extfs /
seriala /dev/ttyS0
serialb /dev/ttyS1
udptunnel false
udpport 6066
bootdrive 0
bootdriver 0
ramsize 8388608
frameskip 6
modelid 5
cpu 3
fpu false
nocdrom false
nosound false
noclipconversion false
nogui false
jit false
jitfpu false
jitdebug false
jitcachesize 0
jitlazyflush false
jitinline false
keyboardtype 5
keycodes false
mousewheelmode 1
mousewheellines 3
dsp /dev/dsp
mixer /dev/mixer
ignoresegv false
idlewait true

The cpu, frameskip and the ramsize are different.

FranceMSR

Pay attention that during installation modelid is 14 but at the final step modelid is 5. You posted a wrong configuration files, that is not the same of RetroPie Italia Forum ;-)

edmaul69

@francemsr which mac is modelid5? I use a quadra900.rom so the modelid i use is 20. I used 14 as well seems to function the same.

Edit: found it is a macintosh se

spud11

@francemsr Okay, thanks. I've changed that now. The only things different are the cpu, frameskip and ramsize. Is it likely any of them would make any difference at all?

Meneer Jansen

@spud11 said in Macintosh (Basilisk II) 8-bit Color:

@francemsr Okay, thanks. I've changed that now. The only things different are the cpu, frameskip and ramsize. Is it likely any of them would make any difference at all?

I Changed the procedure in post 137 to include the frameskip setting to 0 (did that myself already but forgot to put it in post 137). PoP2 rus much more "fluently" that way.
What the CPU setting does is not explained in the official documentation here. Just like the "displaycolordepth" setting it might be a recently added setting that is still undocumented. On my system it is (still) set to "5"
My RAM size is set to 8 MB (i.e. 8388608). Don't think it'll make much difference though. PoP2 still runs kinda slow and the background music runs at 60 BPM (1 beat per second). Oh, well.
My model ID is set to 5 and I work w/ MacOS 8. The official help file says that one must set it to 14 for MacOS 8. Did that just now and I don't notice any difference.

FranceMSR

@meneer-jansen said in Macintosh (Basilisk II) 8-bit Color:

I Changed the procedure in post 137...

I don't understand why you continuously change your post when the correct procedure is this :D
You have to install your own system! Don't use a pre-made disk ;-)

mediamogul

The problem may be that there are so many variables involved in any particular install, that no one set of instructions is going to be completely accurate for all users. I've noticed a few particulars on all sides that I haven't found to be the case with my own install and some things that worked for me, didn't for others here. Perhaps ironing out 8-bit color in BasiliskII on the Pi just isn't possible with any absolute certainty.

Meneer Jansen

@francemsr said in Macintosh (Basilisk II) 8-bit Color:

@meneer-jansen said in Macintosh (Basilisk II) 8-bit Color:

I Changed the procedure in post 137...

I don't understand why you continuously change your post when the correct procedure is this :D
You have to install your own system! Don't use a pre-made disk ;-)

To make your own disk there is already a procedure on the internet: https://emaculation.com/doku.php/basiliskii_linux_setup .

I'm updating siad procedure to help others. If it is not appreciated or if people want to learn Italian first and then go to an Italian forum to follow another procedure, well, that's just silly. The problem is NOT pre-made disks, because in the past I made my own disk w/ MacOS 7 etc. which is very much work and very complicated (see link above, that's where everybody here got their procedure from!). Didn't work either against the "8-bit problem". Because the problem lies NOT in the virtual hard disk used by BasiliskII, troll. Constantly referring to Italian forums and complicated procedures to make your own 1 GB disk is not the solution. If my efforts are not appreciated, well, TRFM and FU then. Sod it.

Bye. :-(

FranceMSR

@mediamogul said in Macintosh (Basilisk II) 8-bit Color:

The problem may be that there are so many variables involved in any particular install, that no one set of instructions is going to be completely accurate for all users. I've noticed a few particulars on all sides that I haven't found to be the case with my own install and some things that worked for me, didn't for others here. Perhaps ironing out 8-bit color in BasiliskII on the Pi just isn't possible with any absolute certainty.

You're wrong. If you install MacOS in the way described in the guide you can ALWAYS use 256 color mode (as other user did)

FranceMSR

@meneer-jansen said in Macintosh (Basilisk II) 8-bit Color:

To make your own disk there is already a procedure on the internet: https://emaculation.com/doku.php/basiliskii_linux_setup .

I'm updating siad procedure to help others. If it is not appreciated or if people want to learn Italian first and then go to an Italian forum to follow another procedure, well, that's just silly. The problem is NOT pre-made disks, because in the past I made my own disk w/ MacOS 7 etc. which is very much work and very complicated (see link above, that's where everybody here got their procedure from!). Didn't work either against the "8-bit problem". Because the problem lies NOT in the virtual hard disk used by BasiliskII, troll. Constantly referring to Italian forums and complicated procedures to make your own 1 GB disk is not the solution. If my efforts are not appreciated, well, TRFM and FU then. Sod it.

Bye. :-(

You can use 100MB, 500MB or 1GB HDD. If you open your mind and use Google Translate with the italian forum page (as other user did) maybe you could use 256 color mode without any extra effort. If that guide is complicated maybe you have to stop to use a computer.

Bye

mediamogul

@francemsr said in Macintosh (Basilisk II) 8-bit Color:

You're wrong.

Perhaps, but can you prove it with math? Actually, math isn't really my thing, but I do like puppets... as long as they're not doing math.

spud11

My goal is to be able to start POP2 automatically from Retropie while invoking xboxdrv to allow joystick control. Like most early computer games, POP2 uses the keyboard for its controls. As early computer games used a variety of keyboard controls and there was no real consistency in the keys used, I find it's better to have individual bash scripts invoking xboxdrv and starting each game with an individual xboxdrv configuration suited to that particular game. (I'm only going to install a few games anyway, so it's not a great amount of work doing it this way.)

For what it's worth:

@Meneer-Jansen's method (when it worked) automatically started POP2 for me, but I can't now get meneer's method to work at all for some reason. This method though is a lot quicker to setup.
The Retropie Italia method of setting up MacOS currently doesn't allow me to start POP2 automatically and is a more laborious process of setting up initially, but it is very reliable from an installation perspective.

I've taken the Retropie Italia method and started trying other methods of getting POP2 to start automatically using bash scripts, but without success so far. In fact, I've replicated the black screen of death while testing. After getting the black screen, I made a backup of the Retropie Italia files I created initially and just copied them back over to the Pi and it worked straightaway again, so I can test things quite quickly and easily now.

Having had a look at the emaculation website, the black screen issue seemed to arise in a whole heap of situations over a long period of time. Lots of methods were suggested for fixing it, but it seemed to keep coming back. I'm thinking the problem is like you described @mediamogul, a variable one that might not be fixable as such.

I'm going to continue to see if I can achieve my goal, but I'm pretty doubtful I'll be able to do it in which case I'll just have to be satisfied that at least I can get the Mac to work and will need to start POP2 manually each time.

mediamogul

@spud11 said in Macintosh (Basilisk II) 8-bit Color:

I'll just have to be satisfied that at least I can get the Mac to work and will need to start POP2 manually each time.

That's more or less how I have mine set up. I've got one xboxdrv map for my controller that will work generically throughout the Mac environment, with mouse control and all. However, I have it set to automatically launch an altered map specifically for Pop2 that retains mouse support to launch the game. I'd love for the situation to be different, but as it stands, I'm skeptical that there's going to be a perfect solution to all this that suits everyone barring an upstream fix.

spud11

@mediamogul That's interesting. Could I ask please how you shift from the generic Mac xboxdrv map to your POP2 map?

Interestingly, I tried an individual bash script to start the MacOS and it led to the black screen. It looks to me as though the only effective or reliable way I'm able to start the MacOS is via the empty start.txt file with emulators.cfg having the following content:

basilisk = "/opt/retropie/emulators/basilisk/bin/BasiliskII --config /opt/retropie/configs/macintosh/basiliskii.cfg"
default = "basilisk"

Upstream fixes would be the only way, like you said.

spud11

@mediamogul While having a look at the emaculation website again, I came across the following thread about creating aliases (shortcuts, I suppose) to applications so that they start automatically on starting up MacOS. I haven't played with this yet, but it looks like a way of getting around the fact it doesn't seem possible to start a game automatically from the command line in Retropie.

https://www.emaculation.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6133

mediamogul

@spud11 said in Macintosh (Basilisk II) 8-bit Color:

I came across the following thread about creating aliases (shortcuts, I suppose) to applications so that they start automatically on starting up MacOS.

It's funny, because the system I'm emulating on this humble $35 Raspberry Pi (MacOS 8.1) is actually the first computer system I ever ran, back when it cost an arm and a leg. I remember adding those aliases to the startup folder to do all manner of things. I've thought about doing it here myself and it should definitely work.

As far as launching the xboxdrv map automatically. I do something similar to what I've seen @edmaul69 do by adding another emulator system launch command to /opt/retropie/configs/macintosh/emulators.cfg. I don't have it in from of me, but outside of the 8-bit color considerations, I believe the launch command is basically the default. However, it does have a different name, something like 'b2-pop2', which I use to trigger the xboxdrv command from runcommand-onstart.sh in the same way as you might for any other system.

FranceMSR

@mediamogul said in Macintosh (Basilisk II) 8-bit Color:

Perhaps, but can you prove it with math?

There is a guide that explains HOW TO install MacOS 7.5.3 on a blank disk and HOW TO set 256 colors mode. If you follow that guide it ALWAYS works! This is a mathematical fact.

If you use another guide with a different basilisk's configuration file and a disk with a pre-installed OS it's not my problem

Meneer Jansen

@francemsr said in Macintosh (Basilisk II) 8-bit Color:

@mediamogul said in Macintosh (Basilisk II) 8-bit Color:

Perhaps, but can you prove it with math?

There is a guide that explains HOW TO install MacOS 7.5.3 on a blank disk and HOW TO set 256 colors mode. If you follow that guide it ALWAYS works! This is a mathematical fact.

If you use another guide with a different basilisk's configuration file and a disk with a pre-installed OS it's not my problem

There's nothing special about setting a (virtual) Mac to 256 colors. Click on the Apple logo at the upper left hand side and choose: Control panels --> Monitors --> tick "Color" and "256" (see this post). You just don't understand how a classic Mac works. How, and where, this setting is kept I don't know. Maybe somewhere in the virtual hard disk (i.e. disk.img) maybe in the (hidden) files /home/pi/.basilisk_ii_prefs or /home/pi/.basilisk_ii_xpram. To keep on advising people to make their own disk image is misanthropic. It's not necessary. And when the "make your own disk" method goes wrong you advise people to use a backup of the image that was made. That's the same as re-downloding the "PoP Macintosh Total Pack" and using those disk images again.

Furthermore, making a Macintosh disk image can not be done on the Pi because the BaiiskII version of the Pi does not have a GUI.

You're trolling this topic w/ statements that aren't true and by referring to a forum in Italian that is incomprehensible for non-Italians (even when run through Google translate). Don't point to other topics in this one to get people stop people reading this one please.

FranceMSR

Are you kidding me??? Here the problem is not set 256 colors mode but that if you do this in the wrong way the emulator shows a black screen.

The italian guide ALWAYS works... In the italian forum there are 3 BLANK disks for installing MacOS.

You said:
"And when the "make your own disk" method goes wrong you advise people to use a backup of the image that was made."

WHEN IT GOES WRONG AND... WHEN I SAID THIS???

Stop trolling, thanks. I'll post a translation of the italian guide so maybe you can open your mind.