Vice vs LR-Vice?

ohmycommodore

Playing with a new RPie build on 3B+ and hadn't noticed until now (since I mostly use original C= hardware) that there are two versions of Vice.

Anyone familiar enough with them to explain the main differences between them? Does one run better in some way or is one the preferred choice these days? Thanks.

Jungle Jim

@ohmycommodore Both run the games very well. The difference is the interface. I find vice interface cumbersome and hard to control. Lr-vice uses the regular lr hotkeys and has a great virtual keyboard for all those c64 games that sometimes start with F1, or F3, or space, or run-stop, or whatever. The virtual keyboard can easily access these. You can also configure the several buttons on your gamepad for some of these keys. For example I configured a button on my gamepad to change the joystick port. So lr-vice all the way for me.

CCFox

@ohmycommodore

I used to use VICE standalone on my old PC Emulation Station build and I thought it was great.

But when I bought A RPi3B+ and installed it and the select and start exit wouldn't work I was gutted. Didn't want to have a keyboard attached all the time. When I saw that @valerino had created some scripts that split vice into the separate emulators with the select start exit option installed it straight away. Blitz on the VIC-20....Bliss. Still needs that keyboard though as I can't configure that controller....

KR

CCF

ohmycommodore

@CCFox Can you point me to how to split up the Commodore systems? Is it one of the optional or experimental packages in RetroPie-Setup? I know I'd have to install lr-vice first, but what next?

I agree keeping the unified start-select thing seems useful.

valerino

@ohmycommodore https://retropie.org.uk/forum/topic/25576/new-scriptmodules-lr-vice-xvic-gsplus-proper-lr-mess-integration
you can either install my own version of Retropie-Setup (which includes 30+ new systems using lr-mess plus other stuff and fixes here and there) or just use the lr-vice-xxx scripts to install other flavors of vice (vic20, plus4, c128, pet).
enjoy!

ohmycommodore

@valerino I'll check it out and see what I can make of it. Has there been interest in moving some of these other systems into the main RPi install?

BuZz

Regarding the original topic, for games I sometimes use lr-vice, but prefer standalone for other uses such as watching demos and anything code related.

RetroPie isn't just for games :-)

valerino

@ohmycommodore i tried to issue a PR, but no luck :)

BuZz

I have code to add the other lr-vice targets. I'll add it after I've tested it. Ah I think we discussed this on the PR.

valerino

@BuZz yep, you can do also a single script and build the n different vice systems from source + add the n emulators each with a different target. i choosen the quick path :)

BuZz

It makes sense to do it in one module as most of the source is shared so it doesn't make much difference to build time.

https://github.com/RetroPie/RetroPie-Setup/pull/3126

valerino

thanks, i'll use it in mine too :) btw @BuZz are you sure all of them works ?
i' d add a clean in the loop to be sure it doesn't reuse obj and automatically generated stuff.

for target in $(_get_targets_lr-vice); do
        make clean
        make EMUTYPE="$target"
        md_ret_require+=("$md_build/vice_${target}_libretro.so")
    done

BuZz

Should do. The original vice code generates all targets without recompiling afair. But I will test of course. If they don't work without a clean, they are better split, but the modules can still share code etc.

BuZz

@valerino looks like the makefiles for libretro are not smart enough so a clean is needed as you say. I will have a think whether to do as one or spit.

I can see a use for Vic and plus4 as modules. Not sure how much demand there is for pet and c128. The standalone vice is likely more useful for those.

ohmycommodore

For Commodore systems, to me, PET, Vic20 and C64 would be the most interesting and useful as "vanilla installs", as they rank as the most popular and notable models. They are also different enough from one to the next that you can see the evolution.

Mirroring my own use of them as a pre-teen and teen, PET was something most people saw or used in school, and it was not in colour. Vic20 was very much a home system and had the jump to colour and increase in software and games. C64 of course was an explosion of that to a massive scale. Although they were all BASIC machines, there's a pretty clear difference between them.

And yeah I wouldn't group the 128 in with them. There wasn't a lot of original software, and most people simply used their 128 in "64 mode" – which is why Commodore then went back and doubled down on the 64, creating the 64C (which was a 64 with the more angular case design from the 128, instead of the more rounded "breadbin" style from the 64). To me, it doesn't really rank as unique as the others.

The C16 and Plus 4 were I think released in there between the 64 and 128. They may be different enough to consider, but going backwards in evolutionary terms. They were marketing attempts at going cheaper, not better.

My knowledge doesn't stretch as much into the Amiga years, but I'm sure there's a similar subset of Amiga models that would be the most popular and most distinct. That criteria, to me, makes certain models the best to preserve, emulate, collect, etc.

That's a North American perspective on it.

quicksilver

@ohmycommodore said in Vice vs LR-Vice?:

There wasn't a lot of original software, and most people simply used their 128 in "64 mode"

So true! I remember my dad spent the extra money to get the 128 and I don't think we ended up getting any software that actually took advantage of it. :)

UDb23

@BuZz One vote for making Vic-20 (standalone vice) available as (dedicated) system in ES/Carbon as default.
Logos and required launch options are available as you know.
Would be really appreciated.

ohmycommodore

Vic 20 added in 2020 is better than all other things in 2020. It's a can't miss really.