Mame 2003 wont start

herb_fargus

@Meneer-Jansen I didn't write the documentation just so I could answer the same questions over and over again

Meneer Jansen

@dankcushions I've probably been playing classic games since before lots of you were born. And been using Mame since the nineties. Always put my favorite roms in a directory. So I do not have to browse through a lot of games I don't play. Guess I'm getting old. Parent roms? I understand what you mean. Guess I have to format me a new SD card (for the x GB of Mame games I don't play) or find out what parent ROMs my favorite games use.

Thanks for the explanation. :)

Meneer Jansen

@herb_fargus said in Mame 2003 wont start:

@Meneer-Jansen I didn't write the documentation just so I could answer the same questions over and over again

The answer is not to be found in your documentation. And now you at least tell that its the docs you'd like me to read. The link you posted is about mentioning system specs, docs, etc. etc.

I've been active on Linux forums for many years and have to tell the same things over and over again too. And I'm happy to do so. Depending on the question and the persons' experience I sometimes explain basic things and sometimes I refer to documentation. But never in the way you do. That's impolite rtfm behavior. You'll know what I mean if you ever ask a newbe question or start using some OS or piece of software you haven't used for years. It might be your age, might be your mood. Anyway, it all right now. ;)

iconrumble

@Meneer-Jansen You could use clrmamepro and rebuild a non merged set, then you could use each rom as stand-alone...
A non merged set means that each ROM file has all the necessary files, thus not being dependent on parent roms. Check the Retropie Wiki - Managing ROMs.

Meneer Jansen

@iconrumble said in Mame 2003 wont start:

@Meneer-Jansen You could use clrmamepro and rebuild a non merged set, then you could use each rom as stand-alone...
A non merged set means that each ROM file has all the necessary files, thus not being dependent on parent roms. Check the Retropie Wiki - Managing ROMs.

Aaaaahhh! That's what clrmame means by merged sets and split sets etc. At first I thought that meant that the "new" roms (that you converted from and "old" set of ROMs) are put in a separate folder so you always get to keep your "old" roms (in a separate folder). Now I understand why those roms that one can download from certain "rom sites" work standalone and roms from romsets don't!

And now I know why I was refered to the documentation. My mistake. But in a way quantum mechanics are easier to understand that crlmamepro. BTW in the Wiki are the terms 'zip file' and 'folder' used for the same thing (i.e. a zip file w/ rom images)? Anyway, Il' see when I create a non-merged set.

iconrumble

@Meneer-Jansen yes, the folder-thing is quite confusing...
short version:
merged: original game and clones on the same zip
split: each game/clone has its own zip, but clones need parent zip to run
non merged: each game/clone has its own zip and they work standalone.

dankcushions

how do merged sets even work with retropie? if it's one zip with several clones within, then ES surely sees it as one 'game', but then what is loaded? how do you pick which clone to load? anyone tried this?

i think the wiki could be revised for this section maybe to make it super clear, but mame is a bit weird in this regard. my recommendation is always to deal with full sets unless you know what you're doing. we have custom .dat files that have a reduced sets with no clones, etc, which can make them easier to manage.

Finhead

@dankcushions said in Mame 2003 wont start:

how do merged sets even work with retropie? if it's one zip with several clones within, then ES surely sees it as one 'game', but then what is loaded? how do you pick which clone to load? anyone tried this?

i think the wiki could be revised for this section maybe to make it super clear, but mame is a bit weird in this regard. my recommendation is always to deal with full sets unless you know what you're doing. we have custom .dat files that have a reduced sets with no clones, etc, which can make them easier to manage.

I use Merged Sets, that's what Herb says he uses in his instruction video so it seemed the way to go.

senkun

@dankcushions from the few merged sets I've tried, it's the parent clone that's called. Can't choose. I do non-merged if I have a specific clone I like and then only have that one on the pi. I prefer split sets and filters, but I don't run sdhcs over 32gb so yeah, a picked combo of merged and non-merged works for me.

dankcushions

@senkun

@dankcushions from the few merged sets I've tried, it's the parent clone that's called. Can't choose. I do non-merged if I have a specific clone I like and then only have that one on the pi. I prefer split sets and filters, but I don't run sdhcs over 32gb so yeah, a picked combo of merged and non-merged works for me.

thanks! personally i have parents only. it's a bit annoying when there's the occasional game (pacman/puckman, moonwalker's broken parent/working clone) where the parent isn't what i want, but it makes things simpler.

i still don't understand why you'd ever want a merged zip on your pi, though, if it always runs the parent. surely in that case you'd just want the parent zip otherwise it's just wasted space??

senkun

@dankcushions argh! I meant a picked "combo of splits and non merged"! For exactly the same reasons as you so i can get rid of puckman split set and just have pacman non merged in there.

I do think it's confusing with the terms merged, non merged and split. I try to remember by picturing this;

Merged - one big family unit, children have no say and not seen, parents decide everything.

Non merged - children have grown up and are independent from parents.

Split - children are trying to be independent but really can't function without parents present.

caver01

You can get away with a custom merge if you are willing to take the time. Open the zip of the clone you like, then drop in the rom files from the parent. Re-zip using the clone's name.

The clone is still played, since your re-zip still has the name of the clone and this is what MAME is told to launch), but the dependencies are included right there inside the zip file, so the game runs as though the parent zip is right next to it.

This little trick has allowed me to play my clones, have the parent files, but NOT have the parent showing up in the list. Seems to be the ideal solution. It doesn't seem to work with FBA though.

caver01

I guess you could also just take a merged rom and rename it to the name of your favorite clone. That should work too, don't you think?

dankcushions

@caver01 said in Mame 2003 wont start:

I guess you could also just take a merged rom and rename it to the name of your favorite clone. That should work too, don't you think?

maybe!

i reworded some of the wiki page regarding sets - hope this clears things up?: https://github.com/RetroPie/RetroPie-Setup/wiki/Managing-ROMs#step-5--rebuild-a-rom-set

Meneer Jansen

I made a set of non-merged ROMs w/ clrmamepro yesterday night. They do not seem to work w/ libretto-mame2003. I'm beginning to think that the 0.78 ROM set I'm working with ain't even a 0.78 set. Does anyone know how to determine the ROM set you have? And how to determine if you have a merged or -non-merged ROM?

Oh, and by the way, how do I determine which parent my clone needs?

iconrumble

@Meneer-Jansen did you use the correct DAT file to rebuild your set? Any error output from clrmamepro (files missing?)? Did you check the retropie compatibility list?
The best way to check your romset would be to get a 0.78 DAT file from a trusted source and scan your romset for errors...

dankcushions

@Meneer-Jansen said in Mame 2003 wont start:

I made a set of non-merged ROMs w/ clrmamepro yesterday night. They do not seem to work w/ libretto-mame2003. I'm beginning to think that the 0.78 ROM set I'm working with ain't even a 0.78 set. Does anyone know how to determine the ROM set you have?

if you give clrmamepro a 0.78 datfile, and rebuild or scan, it will tell you whether your source is valid or not. the ones that come out the other end WILL be valid if you told it to do the right thing. if it wasn't valid, nothing would come out...

And how to determine if you have a merged or -non-merged ROM?

don't upload it, but have a look in the .zip of an example that doesn't work. does it contain all the files needed? you can work that out by looking for relevant entry in your 0.78 .dat file via a text editor. it will show you all the files needed. if a parent is needed, your unmerged .zip should contain all their zips also.

your set won't be merged unless you told clrmamepro to merge it. downloaded sets are almost always split sets.

Oh, and by the way, how do I determine which parent my clone needs?

i thought you made merged sets? there is no need for the parent.

anyway, read the wiki. look at the compatibility lists. there's a column for parents.

Meneer Jansen

@dankcushions said in Mame 2003 wont start:

@Meneer-Jansen said in Mame 2003 wont start:

I made a set of non-merged ROMs w/ clrmamepro yesterday night. They do not seem to work w/ libretto-mame2003. I'm beginning to think that the 0.78 ROM set I'm working with ain't even a 0.78 set. Does anyone know how to determine the ROM set you have?

if you give clrmamepro a 0.78 datfile, and rebuild or scan, it will tell you whether your source is valid or not. the ones that come out the other end WILL be valid if you told it to do the right thing. if it wasn't valid, nothing would come out...

And how to determine if you have a merged or -non-merged ROM?

don't upload it, but have a look in the .zip of an example that doesn't work. does it contain all the files needed? you can work that out by looking for relevant entry in your 0.78 .dat file via a text editor. it will show you all the files needed. if a parent is needed, your unmerged .zip should contain all their zips also.

your set won't be merged unless you told clrmamepro to merge it. downloaded sets are almost always split sets.

Oh, and by the way, how do I determine which parent my clone needs?

i thought you made merged sets? there is no need for the parent.

anyway, read the wiki. look at the compatibility lists. there's a column for parents.

Thank you all again for the help. The method that I used is the one from here which, I believe, was written by you. The DAT file that I used is from the same Wiki (downloaded a Zip file w/ lots of DAT's in it that are "meant" to use w/ RetroPie). I used the 0.78 DAT.

After the non-merging I ended up w/ a set that is 13.5 GB, the original set is 8.5 GB. So something did happen here... The messages that clrmamepro put out for 4718 ROM's are too many to see or note down for me...

The original "Puckman" (that's the Japanese Namco version of Pac-Man before it was put on the market by Midway) which I consider to be the Mother Of All Pac-Man's now (non-merged) has these ROM files in the zip:

82s123.7f
82s126.1m
82s126.3m
82s126.4a
pacman.5e
pacman.5f
namcopac.6e
namcopac.6f
namcopac.6h
namcopac.6j

Thanks for the tip about the DAT file opening in a text editor. This is what the file MAME_78_for_Mame2003.dat says about puckman:

<game name="puckman">
<description>PuckMan (Japan set 1)</description>
<year>1980</year>
<manufacturer>Namco</manufacturer>
<rom name="82s123.7f" size="32" crc="2fc650bd" sha1="8d0268dee78e47c712202b0ec4f1f51109b1f2a5"/>
<rom name="82s126.1m" size="256" crc="a9cc86bf" sha1="bbcec0570aeceb582ff8238a4bc8546a23430081"/>
<rom name="82s126.3m" size="256" crc="77245b66" sha1="0c4d0bee858b97632411c440bea6948a74759746"/>
<rom name="82s126.4a" size="256" crc="3eb3a8e4" sha1="19097b5f60d1030f8b82d9f1d3a241f93e5c75d6"/>
<rom name="namcopac.6e" size="4096" crc="fee263b3" sha1="87117ba5082cd7a615b4ec7c02dd819003fbd669"/>
<rom name="namcopac.6f" size="4096" crc="39d1fc83" sha1="326dbbf94c6fa2e96613dedb53702f8832b47d59"/>
<rom name="namcopac.6h" size="4096" crc="02083b03" sha1="7e1945f6eb51f2e51806d0439f975f7a2889b9b8"/>
<rom name="namcopac.6j" size="4096" crc="7a36fe55" sha1="01b4c38108d9dc4e48da4f8d685248e1e6821377"/>
<rom name="pacman.5e" size="4096" crc="0c944964" sha1="06ef227747a440831c9a3a613b76693d52a2f0a9"/>
<rom name="pacman.5f" size="4096" crc="958fedf9" sha1="4a937ac02216ea8c96477d4a15522070507fb599"/>
</game>

This seems to be a parent to me. For insatance, for the game puckmania is sys in the DAT file:

Strange it won't work in lr-mame2003 for me. Advance Mame and Mame4All both work for me in RetroPie (be it w/ the proper ROMs!). Might I've set something wrong in Emulationstation? One can alter certain settings after pushing a button or two during the loading of the emulator. I've altered my settings to use the CEA-3 video mode which works for Advance Mame. The standard settings for lr-mame2003 won't work either.

Very frustrating that one cannot test mame2003 on the command line. I think I'll give up and keep on using adv-mame and search the internet for a 0.94 ROM set.

The Mame wiki says that there's a way to let Mame tell you if you've got the right ROM:

mame -verifyroms puckman

That works on my PC but not on my Pi because RetroPie uses "special" (?) versions of Mame. Example of output on my PC:

mame -verifyroms puckman
romset puckman is good
1 romsets found, 1 were OK.

When I do that w/ a "wrong" rom I get:

mame -verifyroms bigkong
bigkong : dk01f7_2532.d5 (4096 bytes) - NOT FOUND
bigkong : dk02f8_2532.f5 (4096 bytes) - NOT FOUND
bigkong : dk03f9_2532.h5 (4096 bytes) - NOT FOUND
bigkong : dk04f10_2532.k5 (4096 bytes) - NOT FOUND
bigkong : dk05f11_2532.l5 (4096 bytes) - NOT FOUND
romset bigkong [ckong] is bad
1 romsets found, 0 were OK.

Meneer Jansen

Example of trying to verify a ROM w/ advmame on RetroPie:

./advmame -verifyroms dkong
Unknown command line option '-verfyroms'

Mame4all seems to support this commandline option, but that still will not tell me if mame2003 has the proper ROMs.

dankcushions

@Meneer-Jansen said in Mame 2003 wont start:

Very frustrating that one cannot test mame2003 on the command line.

yes you can. https://github.com/libretro/RetroArch/wiki/Using-the-command-line
although i'm not sure why you'd want to? if you want to see what errors you're getting, look at /tmp/runcommand.log

your rom looks good to me. it's a parent, but since you've made non-merged sets, it's irrelevant - clones are now standalone as they don't need their parents to run. that's the point :)

That works on my PC but not on my Pi because RetroPie uses "special" (?) versions of Mame.

we're talking about versions of mame that are over a decade apart. the libretro versions no longer function in the same way, in any case. still, none of this is needed because you don't need mame to tell you if your roms are valid, and mame2003 functions perfectly.

you are running 3.7, right? if not, you might want to rebuild retroarch from binaries.