Apple ii Keyboard setup
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@briandamico in linapple i have no clue. I use an apple iie joystick. If the game doesnt support the keyboard for controls. Most games give you an option to choose either a keyboard or a joystick. So i would test other games you actually want to play. There are multiple versions of some games and the controls can be different so test every version of that game to find one that works for you. You can also google the instructions for apple ii games and read the apple versions manual for controls. Sometimes if you look up a pic of the floppy disk, the instructions are on the label of the disk
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@briandamico said in Apple ii Keyboard setup:
@caver01 I understand what your saying
ok so I at least need a keyboard with f1 keys to get set up.
If you say so--it probably depends on the emulator you plan to use. I never use F-keys in AdvanceMESS, but I think Linapple will be easier if you have them.
but when I have all this ready to go. what would be my next steps then to set up properly.
Again, depends on emulator. For linapple, I think there is a config file for setting the keys, but I don't use it. Check the docs. If you want to try AdvanceMESS, you can maybe follow along with what I did in this post, but I was basically trailblazing there, making up my configuration as I went along. Of all of the possible ways to get Apple II emulation running, MESS is tricky.
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@briandamico i should note that the arrow keys werent commonly used for direction in games. The used letters in a pyramid pattern. Some games have versions listed as "modified keys"
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@edmaul69 said in Apple ii Keyboard setup:
@briandamico i should note that the arrow keys werent commonly used for direction in games. The used letters in a pyramid pattern
Yeah, and many used a combo: A, Z for up/down, and LEFT RIGHT arrows for left and right. Spacebar often was jump, shoot, etc. Also, ESC often paused the game.
Apple Panic for instance used IJKM for directions, and others use IJKL which is more like the WASD used in a lot of FPS games today.
I didn't realize linapple had two-button joystick limitations. One nice thing about MESS is that it lets you map keys to the analog joystick inputs.
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@caver01 yeah lode runner lets you use the closed apple key as button 1 if you have it set up as 2 seperate player joysticks. technically only having 1 joystick is apple ii/iie correct. In games like mario bros had you both use a paddle and a button, but technically that is 1 controller. Linapple just made it so you can have 2 seperate controllers. So games that used a 4 way joystick that are 2 player games actually have the player 2 use the keyboard on an apple ii/iie.
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@edmaul69 Interesting. I have two joysticks on my actual IIe. IIR one of them plugs in with a DIP connector on a ribbon cable through a slot and onto the MoBo and the other is maybe a 9-pin DIN. . . Are you saying Linapple has problems emulating two joysticks with two buttons each and that you have to make some compromise?
Now that I think about it, I know several examples where two players could use the two joysticks at the same time, but I don't know if both buttons get used. One-on-One (Dr.J, L.Bird) could be played with two joysticks, but I think you use the same button to spin, hold to jump, and release to shoot. Interesting.
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@caver01 so thinking of it, i think you are right about two joysticks. And yes i believe that it disables one of the buttons. So i think what linapple does when you choose two joysticks is correct. However, i think most games didnt have that option. Do you have an apple ii, ii plus, iie or iigs?
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@edmaul69 I have a //e, rev.b. My dad bought it right when they came out with double-high res graphics. I remember bringing it home and finding out we had an earlier revision, and he was like, wait, they told us it would be a rev.b! I think we marched it back to the shop and demanded a replacement. So, for an hour, we had a Rev A board.
Anyway, I have fond memories of Dazzle Draw, but beyond that, I don't remember anything that I had that took advantage of the additional colors and resolution. It's a great machine though and it still works!
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@caver01 I remember a couple years later, still enjoying the //e standing in the shop looking at a brand new Macintosh 512k and asking the sales guy, "Why in the WORLD anyone would need 512k of RAM?" He shrugged and said, "Apparently, there is software that can actually use it!". Later, we bought a Mac+, upgraded it to an 020 and added a Radius Full-Page Display and 4mb of RAM (at $100/mb).
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@caver01 I wish I could lay my hands on that mac+ keyboard now and transform it into a modern USB mech keyboard to blow my friends' minds (or just piss off my wife).
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@caver01 I love hearing stories like that! just stories like that about old Apples are the best. no one ever has stories like that for an IBM lol...
This is exactly why I want to be able to play a few games on the pie with an apple keyboard . to make it like it was. just for a little bit.so if I need a joystick for some/most games, what would be the best option for that. is there anything that hooks up via to the keyboard? or does it have to be usb? or back to what I was hoping, changing values to use the keyboard
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@briandamico Oh man, You have a lot of options, but my experience with this is limited to digital (switch-based arcade hardware) which is easy to wire up to GPIO pins and use a GPIO driver for that, or a USB keyboard controller (like IPAC). I think you should just take a tour through the controllers section of the wiki.
@edmaul69 maybe has suggestions, as he's actually using his Apple II shell/keyboard. What do you use for a joystick?
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@caver01 you can. I do it everyday with my apple iie pi. I have a mac m0110A keyboard attached to it with this adapter:
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=72052.0
It also has all the keys including f keys with using the | \ key as an fn key.
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I like this usb conversion idea. I may try that at some point.
but let me ask you both something.
without getting crazy with having 2-3 keyboards, a mouse, controller, joystick lol. lots of stuff here.now, am I correct in saying each game will offer different values and keys to play it for all apple ii games?
now if that is the case, could a Nintendo wii pro controller which has 2 joysticks a left and right be used for games like ALF, and if so, does it need to be specifically configured? and I say this for exiting, OR use the keyboard for that.now if they controller is ok for some games that need joystick compatibility, they making sure the keyboard is capable of basic functions for the games that do need the keyboard and also exiting the game.
does this make sense?
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@edmaul69 said in Apple ii Keyboard setup:
Ha ha ha. I figured folks were using TMK. I think there is another mech keyboard project in my future!
I use a Minivan as my main keyboard now. It's cool, but I miss the apostrophe and hyphen more than I want to admit.
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@briandamico @caver01 they have adapters here for an apple iie joystick and and adapters for using an apple iie or iic built in keyboard.
@briandamico i would get a keyboard that has f keys or use adapters like i use that have hidden f keys and all missing keys.
@caver01 is your apple iie enhanced?
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@edmaul69 ok well I just bought an apple II extended keyboard today. gonna be a few days till I get it. and that will for now hook up to that imate usb adaptor I bought.
so I know I keep fixating on ALF, but I am since it a game needing a joystick. if I opt to not want to use an actual joystick, a controller would not be an option? nor the keyboard with or without the F keys.
kind of a pitty there is no true how to video on this anywhere in all the years of emulation.
I thank you both for the continuous support by the way
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@briandamico i also forgot, you can use the wii controller just fine. Set up the joystick config the way i told you. Also in the config you can set up a 1 or 2 button exit key. If you use a controller the f keys are only really needed in linapple to switch disks if you use a multi disk game. All other f key setting can be set in the configuration file.
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@briandamico read previous post. A controller and a joystick are the same in todays world. They didnt have direction pads back then so all controllers were called a joystick
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@edmaul69 ok. I guess I will wait till I get the keyboard to continue with you further on this.
but I assume you mean there will be configure files the linapple emulator and ill be able to use my wii controller for other games and emulators just fine, it won't affect the mapping on those correct? just changing the config file for linapple 2 will make using a game like alf playable?and when you say switch disks thats going back to the game list screen right? and if not, what would we do to simply exit the emulator whether I'm done or loading another disk
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