Pi3B, MAME, lr-MameForAll or lr-Mame03 - Segmentation Faults

crumbs

@dankcushions
I see, I was under the impression that you guys were calling an emulator a BIOS. Probably erroneous information gathered on Youtube.

So as I understand now, we need an emulator, an emulator BIOS and a game ROM. That makes more sense.

Except, if BIOSs are needed and there is a BIOS folder, why is there no documentation on BIOSs in RetroPie.org?

dankcushions

@crumbs said in Pi3B, MAME, lr-MameForAll or lr-Mame03 - Segmentation Faults:

Except, if BIOSs are needed and there is a BIOS folder, why is there no documentation on BIOSs in RetroPie.org?

there is. every system that needs a BIOS will have that detailed on their page. eg https://github.com/retropie/retropie-setup/wiki/Playstation-1#bios

i guess there could be a glossary saying what a BIOS is generally but i think google is enough here.

crumbs

@dankcushions
Well, if I was writing the documentation, which I think should tell people what they need to know, on the very first page, I'd have a What is a BIOS? section straight after What are ROMs? and I'd write two sentences that explain what you've said to me today: "A BIOS is a small piece of software to tell hardware how to work. Some emulators emulate the system's BIOS and some emulators require a BIOS file; whether or not a particular game system needs a BIOS file is specified on that system's page."

I'd also explain that emulators are installed within the RetroPie GUI, because nowhere in the documentation does it say this simple but crucial bit of info.

The reason I'd do this is to eliminate confusion.

markwkidd

The open source world is always in need of documentation help.

From your suggested sentences it seems like you have good English writing skills. The official documentation is all generated from that documentation wiki, which is editable by you if you register a github account.

In other words, you can yourself help make enhancements to the docs. :)

herb_fargus

@crumbs that crucial bit of info has it's own section on the first installation page

https://retropie.org.uk/docs/First-Installation/#installing-additional-emulators

On RetroPie 4.0+, not everything is installed by default. The pre-made images contain the best working emulators for each system supported by the hardware. This should cover everything most users would be doing. Ports like quake and doom and some other emulators like ScummVM can be installed later.

Software can be installed from the RetroPie-Setup script - which is accessible from the RetroPie menu on EmulationStation

Perhaps the bios could be explained on the first page. I just figured I'd keep it simple and then assumed most people already had experience with emulation

At the very least this page could be updated.

https://retropie.org.uk/docs/BIOS/

crumbs

@herb_fargus, you are correct! Apologies.

crumbs

Okay, I have made some very minor changes. Hopefully, they will be approved.
Thanks

Riverstorm

@darksavior said in Pi3B, MAME, lr-MameForAll or lr-Mame03 - Segmentation Faults:

Unless you're using a pi0/1, there is no real reason to ever use mame4all. It's from 2000, emulation isn't the best, and game support is low.

I am not sure what you mean by game support is low but mame4all-pi seems perfectly suited to the under-powered Pi. I think it's still relevant and the emulation is fine. Probably a smaller code foot print compared to the Libretro cores. As a general rule the old MAME's do run faster compared to the newer.

It does allow for better flexibility with input configuration and no double inputs which allow for <not> statements. That's a pretty big deal. The Libretro cores can't do that. If you compare binaries (ROM files) with lr-mame2003 using something like WinMerge you'll find that about 65 to 75 percent are 100% identical.

Two things the Libretro cores do that I find invaluable are DaveJ's shader which is wonderful and also Buzz added that awesome analog stick as D-Pad support. I am not sure but the latter might be doable in mame4all-pi. I mean using an analog stick for control. Some games I prefer it over the D-Pad. It's quite handy for flight games like Zaxxon it works great.

When I upgraded from mame4all-pi to lr-mame2003 I added from 6 to 12 new games. It really didn't change much. The golden age of video games and it's decline really intersects in the mid 80's. 0.78 does have roughly double the ROMs but once you weed out clones (so many clones) and foreign language games the same basic ROM set of relevant games that most played is the same.

When you venture into lr-mame2010 and lr-mame2014 you'll find plenty of games that aren't Pi friendly as they are big jumps in ROM sets and a time era.

I think it really boils down to what features and game sets you are targeting but mame4all-pi is small, rock solid, great input configuration, ported to about every platform & great golden age game support. I wouldn't count it out as a competent and usable MAME emulator.

Darksavior

@riverstorm I meant less games are supported than the other mames and fbas. Mame4all also has a libretro version so no issue there. The emulation is old and not as accurate. Games will have bugs or not run correctly. You might not have noticed it, but I did. It depends on the game.

The pi3 is fast enough to handle those same games on a more recent emulator with more accuracy. It might take some trial and error because games will run differently between fba and mame 2003. I use 4 arcade emulators to effectively run the hundreds of games I want to play because of speed issues, accuracy, and the different games they support.

In the end, fba and mame2003 are the official recommended emulators for the pi2/3 and most agree. If the few games you play run fine for you in mame4all then don't bother.

Riverstorm

@darksavior said in Pi3B, MAME, lr-MameForAll or lr-Mame03 - Segmentation Faults:

Games will have bugs or not run correctly. You might not have noticed it, but I did. It depends on the game.

I agree with that between 0.36 and 0.78 it nearly doubled and between lr-mame2000 and lr-mame2003 I would think a shoe in for the latter and is considered the gold standard in certain aspects except maybe vector where AdvMAME outshines them all. I do agree to that FBA seems to run Neo-Geo, Capcom, Konami games better. They just seem to run smoother for certain.

I do also use multiple emulators too depending on the game. Mainly lr-mame2003 roughly 300 or so games with aforementioned options of shader and analog d-pad support. AdvMAME for vector, FBA for Neo-Geo, etc.

The original author of mame4all-pi (squid) had a majority of the games running at 100% without frame skip. It's been a hobby of mine since the late 90's. I do faithfully download the split updates every few months merge it and join the torrent. That includes the CHD's & extras, etc. I think it's close to 400GB now. It's where I spend most of my time when it comes to emulation.

That's what I was pointing out is the binaries (ROMs) are mostly 100% identical between the two version which are only 3 years apart. I don't believe the driver/board support emulation improved that much between those versions but they went crazy with additions.

You would have to be more specific on what exact games you find buggy in 0.37b5 that work differently in 0.78? My main point is that mame4all-pi (not lr-mame2000) is still very relevant if not a choice not just for the familiarity and support for being so widely ported but also the input configuration is still superior out of the box it works. Meaning there's certain configuration scenarios lr-mame2003 can't do...yet or at least not easily as I believe you will loose hotkey functionality if you "nul" all the Retroarch inputs to rely on lr-mame2003 inputs alone to correct the issue. :)