Why do people buy ready-made kits?

timabc

Married, children, job, commitments beyond tinkering on a computer. Time is fleeting, so kit makes sense.

Damonmath

I actually play video games as opposed to building systems to play video games. I already own a clone Pandora's Box 5S and love it. My Pandora's Box arcade setup plays all the games well, no lag and even has built in shaders and smoothers. It has both VGA and HDMI out. I replaced all the buttons and joysticks with Sanwa competition accessories (silent joysticks and pressure sensitive buttons). It has never crashed nor shown any signs of breaking. Although the Roms are knock offs and there are no title animation sequences, I do have video previews that run without overheating the system. This cost me $99 total and has 999 games (JAMMA board).

I bought a pre-built RetroPie system online ($500) from a guy who builds them out (brand new from scratch). I know nothing about RetroPie or emulationstation or Pi. I was excited at the prospect of 19,000+ games. What I did not expect was a half built and broken system. From day one the SD Micro chip was coded incorrectly and you have to manually type emulationstation at the terminal prompt in order to start ES. I thought this was odd and had the actual developer walk me through how to open the arcade, locate the underside of a tiny (Pi) computer board to locate an SD Micro card that I had to remove with pliers, load into my MAC and change a line of code on the boot drive. This corrected my boot up... but ... N64 doesn't work at all and there is no screen data (images, video, marquees, descriptions). Exiting a game is at your own risk as it can crash the whole system or leave the screen black for long periods of time.

I started digging into what the heck it was I had just dropped 500 bones on... I found Stephen's Scraper and ES themes. I tried Comic book, it didn't take... not even the font. So I tried scraping using Stephen's. My system is on 4.3.8 so I figured I was good to go. At first Neo Geo wasn't showing up (my favorite roms)... oh yeah those were coded wrong and can only be viewed while having the video accelerator turned off. So I turn it off... now the other videos look like garbage and the system is crashing under the heat. So I turn the accelerator back on and live with no video in my favorite emulator.

Sigh...

So I go back to trying to clean up Roms as there are so many broken, duplicate and foreign language Roms that just don't need to be there. I get about half-way through using the file manager and a keyboard to try to delete Roms. So far so good. I have every folder all nice and clean except for MAME and FBA (which are huge). Then disaster. For no known reason (even the Dev is stumped), it all came crashing down and I now have a permanent boost:: error within Roms/atari2600.

I turned to the guy who I bought the system from. He is (still broken as I am typing) being super helpful and attentive, but nothing and I mean nothing is working to fix it. I do not own a PC, so he can't remote into it from there. I own a MAC Book Pro but it's old and has only 53g of available space so I can't even download a new boot file to re-image the drive (118 gigs required). He has been working remotely to try and fix both the boot drive and flash drive to no avail. I offered to pay him to simply clean up all Roms, finish the build, add the scraped data (including video) , change the theme to comic book (carbon now) and then lock me out in kiosk mode so I can save me from myself.

He didn't answer my offer. I really really want to love this setup. I put together the external arcade artwork and love how it looks physically. But as an arcade system it is the worst I have ever attempted to play.

HELP!! It's only been a few days since I've owned it, it's already been broken more than working, and has never worked as advertised from day one. I'm trying to be patient, but I did drop a good bit of money on this system and so far it is an over priced paper weight.

Advice?

ps. For context, I am a UX Designer and a Web Developer. I am in no way interested in steps on how to fix this myself. I have cash and expect a working product. My hobbies are spent in other areas and for me video gaming is a past time in the art of gaming not game building.

dankcushions

@damonmath
step 1: get a refund

there's no step 2, because of:

ps. For context, I am a UX Designer and a Web Developer. I am in no way interested in steps on how to fix this myself. I have cash and expect a working product. My hobbies are spent in other areas and for me video gaming is a past time in the art of gaming not game building.

markwkidd

@damonmath said in Why do people buy ready-made kits?:

I actually play video games as opposed to building systems to play video games. I already own a clone Pandora's Box 5S and love it. My Pandora's Box arcade setup plays all the games well, no lag and even has built in shaders and smoothers. It has both VGA and HDMI out. I replaced all the buttons and joysticks with Sanwa competition accessories (silent joysticks and pressure sensitive buttons). It has never crashed nor shown any signs of breaking. Although the Roms are knock offs and there are no title animation sequences, I do have video previews that run without overheating the system. This cost me $99 total and has 999 games (JAMMA board).

I bought a pre-built RetroPie system online ($500) from a guy who builds them out (brand new from scratch). I know nothing about RetroPie or emulationstation or Pi. I was excited at the prospect of 19,000+ games. What I did not expect was a half built and broken system. From day one the SD Micro chip was coded incorrectly and you have to manually type emulationstation at the terminal prompt in order to start ES. I thought this was odd and had the actual developer walk me through how to open the arcade, locate the underside of a tiny (Pi) computer board to locate an SD Micro card that I had to remove with pliers, load into my MAC and change a line of code on the boot drive. This corrected my boot up... but ... N64 doesn't work at all and there is no screen data (images, video, marquees, descriptions). Exiting a game is at your own risk as it can crash the whole system or leave the screen black for long periods of time.
...
HELP!! It's only been a few days since I've owned it, it's already been broken more than working, and has never worked as advertised from day one. I'm trying to be patient, but I did drop a good bit of money on this system and so far it is an over priced paper weight.

Advice?

ps. For context, I am a UX Designer and a Web Developer. I am in no way interested in steps on how to fix this myself. I have cash and expect a working product. My hobbies are spent in other areas and for me video gaming is a past time in the art of gaming not game building.

I'd ask for a refund
There might very well be a niche for folks willing to set up someone else's RetroPie for them... in fact I bet there is a market. But AFAIK no one has set themselves up to provide this service. Leading to...
In terms of philosophy and values, neither the RetroPie devs or this community are friendly to commercialization of RetroPie. In consequence, RetroPie is not what you want if you want to avoid making the setup and tinkering part of your hobby portfolio.

Folks here like it to be a tinkerer's software stack and a tinkerer's support forum. This is different from, for example, Kodi or the community of Pandora's Box users where commercialization/turnkey hardware is taken as a given. Not only will you find that there is not an easy solution to your problem, you're probably about to find out that the user community here is going to discourage you from even attempting what you're asking.

(That's not how I feel, but that's the way it is.)

mediamogul

@damonmath said in Why do people buy ready-made kits?:

I am in no way interested in steps on how to fix this myself. I have cash and expect a working product.

The RetroPie project and the Raspberry Pi in general are both geared toward hobbyists and therefore are always going to require a certain amount of setup and maintenance on the part of the user. Expecting anything else is just unreasonable. If your interest in solving the issues inherent to owning a RetroPie setup ever change, we're here to help, but keep in mind you'll need to start over with a fresh image from the RetroPie site for us to assist you.

herb_fargus

@damonmath said in Why do people buy ready-made kits?:

I am in no way interested in steps on how to fix this myself

Therein lies your source of disappointment. There is no gratification in throwing money at things hoping for a solution. Especially when the things you are throwing money at are free. It will inevitably break again and you'll be disappointed yet again. Only way this will work is if you learn to set it up from scratch yourself.

strangeruk

I was introduced to RetroPie by someone and, as a slightly matured gamer, the concept of it was brilliant to me and I had fully intended on buying the kit and nabbing a copy of their image so I could get up and running quickly.

Thankfully, I didn't. I bought the components myself and dug out my old DS3's and began building it from scratch - and honestly, it has been the best hobby that I've held for a long time. I'm a long-standing Windows user so the concept of it all was way out of my comfort zone, but I have loved every minute learning the ins-and-outs of the system. From figuring out about MAME/FBA romsets, to modifying themes, to tweaking the system to make it perfect for me (I am now beginning to realise that this will never happen and will constantly find an excuse or 'what-if' scenario to keep me hooked). Like most, I've probably spent more time configuring than I have played on it (although I'm starting to get into retroachievements).

On the flipside, though, I know people who love gaming but simply don't have the time, patience or inclination to do-it-themselves and would much rather a ready built system to get playing with as quick as possible. I know people would argue that 'RetroPie' isn't for them in that case, but when people see it up and running they want a piece of the pie - and who could blame them!

Impman66

I was thinking of getting a made up kit of Pi, case, leads and Power Supply, but then reading through various forums (this one mainly) and watching a few online videos, I thought it didn't look too hard to do myself. So I did it all my self, buying things as and when I could (Christmas helped), now I have a nice little set up, that has just what I want on it, and how I want it to look.
I am now researching the best way to put together a cabinet build (going for cocktail table, as more practical). I am 52 in March so you are never too old to learn.

Damonmath

I returned the item for a refund. It should not be for sale in the first place as a full arcade setup. The retailer tried to blame me for it not working. The system was setup to crash upon exit of a game. Overtime this corrupts the boot drive and causes the whole setup to crash upon launch. How am I as a customer to be expected to know how to re-flash a drive and such? I don't even own a PC with which to become a hobbyist.

I draw the line at buying a product that is half built for hundreds of dollars. And then being expected to be a full blown RetroPie developer? My Pandora's Box kicks this project in the pants and never has any issues what-so-ever.

I'm sure you guys know who this retailer is. I offered him advice that he should take the time to clean up these FREE ROMS and setup the RetroPie properly and then set it to Kid or Kiosk mode before selling it as an arcade. This is not a novice device when set to FULL UI Mode.

PokeEngineer

@chubsta said in Why do people buy ready-made kits?:

Just a little conversation really, having got my first Pi just over a week ago and spending a fair bit of time getting everything up and running I wonder why so many people seem to go for the easy option and buy everything 'ready-made' with roms, joypad etc?

Why? Because ~~these people~~ most people are lazy and/or ~~they want everybody to do everything for them~~ don't want to do this on their own.

Damonmath

@pokeengineer I'm not lazy, just have no interest in building out an arcade setup. I am a UX Designer and Web Developer by trade. 40 hours a week starring at code. When I play games, I want to play games, not build them.

BTW - I am also IOS certified with 2 apps in the APPLE APP store written in native objective C. Something I bet a lot of you would never attempt. So please don't call me lazy. :)

mediamogul

@damonmath said in Why do people buy ready-made kits?:

So please don't call me lazy.

Do you have a problem with "entitled"?

PokeEngineer

@damonmath

Sorry, I should of been more specific on who I was talking about...

Damonmath

Definitely spoiled. I put myself through school and dug myself out of the trailer parks of NC and into the Condos of San Diego. lol I live at the Beach and do tend to be a snob. I grew up super poor and my therapist says it's ok to be a snob. :p

I just have no interest in more coding. especially if each and every ROM has to have some tweak to the emulator. Or have the overclocking tweaked. Then there is the overheating of the UI video support on NeoGeo. Honestly, My retrofreak can handle everything but the super early stuff, anything past PS1 or N64, or MAME / FBA. It is NeoGeo, MAME and FBA games that I am after. Those are not present on Pandora's JAMMA boards.

Sounds more like this project has major issues and the original creators are AWOL. Good start but not even close to prime time.

My biggest worry for the retailer, and this has nothing to do with being lazy, is that he is offering complete cabinets with monitors and 58,000+ games for $4k. Imagine their surprise when that boot drive crashes over and over again on that machine. Lawsuits people, lawsuits.

It's not that I'm entitled or spoiled or lazy... I purchased an advertised product for well over $500 and received garbage.

mediamogul

@damonmath said in Why do people buy ready-made kits?:

Sounds more like this project has major issues and the original creators are AWOL.

You're exaggerating the situation greatly and the creators are right here at any time to help with problems as they arise. That said, tens of thousands of people have downloaded RetroPie for free, set everything up in a few hours and have little to no issues. You unfortunately got taken by a scam artist who didn't know what he was doing and left you in a bad position. It has nothing to do with the RetroPie project.

Guys like the one who got you are a dime a dozen and are just trying to make a quick buck off the back of hardworking programmers. You should really consider yourself lucky that you got your money back and take it as a lesson learned. You've made your position clear to the contrary, but if you ever decide to set your system up correctly from the ground up, this community is always willing to help.

Damonmath

No doubt about the community. I'm not knocking you guys. And I agree that I got lucky. Sadly though I have more than enough skill to setup from scratch, but that wasn't the point. The point is that retailers should not be selling arcades using ES as their setup. That's the scam part. It's not a retail product or the creators would be profiting from it. From what I've read this was never intended for commercial application. Yet here I am complaining about a commercial application.

I purchased an actual hand built JAMMA setup out of Canada from Retro Active Arcades as well and expect it's delivery in Feb. This cost well over 3k and is guaranteed to not have bad/repeat/foreign ROM or UI issues. This is a full blown arcade pedestal as opposed to a project box or full stand up arcade (w/monitor).

When playing retro games one should be more concerned about the CRT it's being played on or the lag from inputs, as opposed to whether the boot drive will hold up for one more round.

Get what I'm saying? If you are going to sell a product, it needs to be fully vetted first and not just a kit with a bunch of free ROMs thrown in. The analogy I used was imagine buying a pre-built model airplane. But then receiving a model airplane shell with too many parts to count or manage and no instruction manual. A customer should never be asked by the retailer to pull an SD Card and flash drive and then allow a remote connection to their personal computer so he can tinker with the chips... and then blame you when he can't fix it.

That was my experience. Super awesome box, terrible internal software.

BTW - if any of you on here have a clean (no dupes, no foreign language, no broken ROMs) working RetroPie setup with Comic book theme and videos galore... hit me up. That's what I am looking for. A working clean crash free version of ES, along with the means to play the games (joystick box for 2 players).

markwkidd

@mediamogul said in Why do people buy ready-made kits?:

Sounds more like this project has major issues and the original creators are AWOL.

I think Damonmouth is referring to the arcade kit as 'this project', not RetroPie :)

dankcushions

@damonmath said in Why do people buy ready-made kits?:

BTW - if any of you on here have a clean (no dupes, no foreign language, no broken ROMs) working RetroPie setup with Comic book theme and videos galore... hit me up. That's what I am looking for. A working clean crash free version of ES, along with the means to play the games (joystick box for 2 players).

in case it's not already clear, any kind of pre-loaded paid-for device is nothing to do with us and in fact almost certainly breaking various retropie and retropie adjacent licenses: https://retropie.org.uk/about/legal/

that also means you can't ask for one here.

your pandora's box works relatively great because it limits itself to <5% of what retropie does, breaks the final burn alpha license (the emulator underneath, which cannot be sold), and comes preloaded with pirated software.

a project (say, retropie) that doesn't break these laws can't curate the end-user experience like that, with all the developers in the world.

mediamogul

@damonmath said in Why do people buy ready-made kits?:

BTW - if any of you on here have a clean (no dupes, no foreign language, no broken ROMs) working RetroPie setup with Comic book theme and videos galore... hit me up.

Requesting pirated material is explicitly not allowed here. You need to read the forum rules.

Damonmath

Yes, I am referring to arcade kits, not RetroPie.

And that's what I figured about the legality of all of this. The retailer I purchased from is breaking the law.

Below is what I experienced and why I'm soured on all of this.

Imagine getting a beautiful graphical box with 2 joysticks, 8 buttons each and a trackball (w/leds). You fire it up and wait 15 minutes for all the Roms to load (no exaggeration), the screen is black and the ROMs are listed by .zip filename centered with no preview, no logo, not even a date. Some ROMs are labeled "[BIOS - Super Mario], or ct_hd2_plus, and neither of those ROMs will launch. You see a black screen then back to the list, or you get this lovely screen of death with what looks like a water bong/joystick. Finally I find that ROM that I've been waiting to play since I was 8... Indian Jones and Temple of Doom on MAME. But there are 4 sets to choose from. So I pick the first one and CRASH. Can't reboot from the terminal (screen is literally frozen at this point), so I am forced to flip the switch (which has now corrupted something in the boot drive) to shut down. I then fire it back up and wait another 15 minutes just to try Set 2 of 4 of the same game. This time it fires up, but upon exit, CRASH again! This went on with just about every game I launched until the boot drive said NO MAS! and died.

As a UX Designer I was beyond pissed at this setup. Not a single minute of joy ever occurred in the 6 days I owned this box. Loved to look at it, but have fire in my heart with each flip of the switch.