ROMS to be downloaded on the RetroPi OS

thepk

I think this because it is easier and the games will be more stable

mediamogul

If you're suggesting that the ability to download ROMs should be added to RetroPie, that would be highly illegal.

RobotLimeLtd

I agree, but I wonder how the Game & Watch titles you can download via RetroArch's Online Updater are not similarly illegal?

mediamogul

@RobotLimeLtd

It's likely that they're infringing on character trademarks. However, the games themselves are only simulations and not derived from the actual programming of the original games. Also, the copyright on the hardware designs ran out a few years ago. Still, Nintendo is an 800 pound gorilla and if they wanted to kick up a fuss, they certainly could.

thepk

But technically, it is not illegal because there is no copyright holding it down. Also, I think there could be licenses, otherwise, how come you can do that on the Xbox live store.

meleu

@thepk said in ROMS to be downloaded on the RetroPi OS:

how come you can do that on the Xbox live store.

Paying.

mediamogul

@thepk

If you're talking about your original post, there's plenty of copyright holding it down. If you're talking about the Game & Watch simulations, then read my previous post. Nintendo wouldn't even have to win the case, as the legal fight would bankrupt most anyone in the ensuing years it would take to litigate the issue. As for licensing; getting the legal rights to one game would be cost prohibitive, let alone tens of thousands of them.

Sano

Actually I'm thinking of something similar on ebook readers.

I don't know the technical details, but on my ebook reader (aldiko), there is a way to add a library through the network (probably HTML/XML), or just as a webpage (kobo).
On the other end , Calibre on my computer has a webservice (content server) providing the good informations, so my e-reader see my PC as a library, can browse, search and download epubs from it, with all necessary metadata/covers.

Could be a sweet alternative to having everything on the pi :

a web service on a PC, with a powerfull rom management tool for scaping everything, and plenty of space
a library function in retropie which connect on the webservice, is able to search/browse it, an either run rom through network or download the rom and associated data.

But what would be the benefits compared to simply store the Retropie folder on a NAS, with roms and everything ? Would it be worth the work ?
Just saying :)

BenMcLean

@mediamogul said in ROMS to be downloaded on the RetroPi OS:

If you're suggesting that the ability to download ROMs should be added to RetroPie, that would be highly illegal.

No, that actually depends heavily on which ROMs we're talking about. There are public domain ROMs, free original homebrew ROMs and even some ROMs of commercial games who the creators have released them as freeware which could be legally put into a downloader on RetroPie. It's just that the ones which are free don't tend to be all that popular or fun. But my point is that downloading ROMs is not inherently illegal just because they're ROMs: it depends on which ROMs they are.

BenMcLean

For example, PDRoms is a site dedicated to reporting about ROMs that are, "Freeware, Donation Ware, Open Source, Public Domain or has otherwise been legalized for free use by their respective owners."

mediamogul

@BenMcLean

All very true, but it was pretty clear that the OP was suggesting illegal ROM packs. He was also promoting illegal ROM sites within a few minutes of his post here that same day and was warned against it. Personally, I'm not a big fan of downloadable public domain ROM packs either. There are already several easy ways to add ROMs to RetroPie and PD games can just as easily be added using any of those methods.

meleu

@BenMcLean the current methods are pretty simple. Maybe it's enough...

By the way, I didn't know that site. Thanks for sharing. ;-)

mediamogul

PD ROM sites are often in violation of IP infringement themselves without really knowing. A good example from the site above is the Future Drivers release of 'Fix-t Felix Jr.', which makes use of the trademarked characters of Disney's 'Wreck-it Ralph', making it impossible to be in the public domain. I think that sometimes these sites actually do know better and are just using the idea of public domain as a distraction, much like is often seen with the legally non-existent software classification of "abandonware".

herb_fargus

@mediamogul playing the devils advocated, you could technically make the same argument for any of the logos in ES and all the metadata that is scraped as well.

Fact is, if any of these companies had any issue realistic or not, we will shut down. no questions asked. and as it is I am honestly surprised we are still around.

mediamogul

@herb_fargus

playing the devils advocated, you could technically make the same argument for any of the logos in ES

You could definitely make that argument. @ChoccyHobNob learned that first hand when the people from intellivisionlives contacted him about the unlicensed use of the Intellivision logo on his case skins. Uniquely stylized fonts and generic images are probably the only real solution and the metadata is questionable fair use, but as mentioned earlier, it doesn't really matter if your not prepared to be tied up in court for years to fight it.

Personally, since there's no commercial use here, I don't think it's worth stressing over the logos, in the same way I don't think it's worth the RetroArch guys worrying about character trademark infringement for the 'Game & Watch' simulations. However, I'm sure that anyone who's aware of the consequences would agree that we should at least make every effort not to associate RetroPie with software piracy wherever possible.

BuZz

@BenMcLean Not sure what your motivation is, but you are not being helpful. Also replying to me on twitter with this - https://twitter.com/RetroPieProject/status/866083499656310784 - no need to stick your oar in there to try and confuse matters.

They are not selling their own software - they are including thousands of commercial/ copyrighted games.

There is no-one I know of just selling RetroPie images with legal roms - also you cannot sell the RetroPie image anyway. It's pretty obvious what this thread is about too.

BenMcLean

My point is that just saying "selling ROMs is illegal" isn't true. This is important because I want to encourage more companies to sell or officially release ROMs of their old games they developed.

BuZz

@BenMcLean We are aware it's ok for people to sell their own work. However the problem we have isn't that. It's people selling/distributing RetroPie with thousands of other people's copyrighted games. It's going to be rather annoying if you plan on "clarifying" your point every time this comes up (And it won't have the effect you want ).

BenMcLean

@BuZz said in ROMS to be downloaded on the RetroPi OS:

However the problem we have isn't that. It's people selling/distributing RetroPie with thousands of other people's copyrighted games.

Many popular open source emulator have this problem.

It's going to be rather annoying if you plan on "clarifying" your point every time this comes up (And it won't have the effect you want ).

I'm saying you need to be very clear that selling ROMs isn't inherently illegal when you talk about this. These companies know what they're doing is illegal and usually wrong as well but public perception on the legality of ROMs and emulators in general matters. Nintendo in particular has been spreading misinformation about this for decades because they want more control over the future of technology to belong to megacorporations like them and to change the law to make projects like RetroArch actually illegal. Just saying "selling ROMs is illegal" normalizes this impression which would make passing laws to that effect much much easier for them.

I think if RetroPie was to distribute a facility to download ROMs that are legally in the clear, this might help dispel the misconception that sharing ROM files is inherently illegal.