Full Size Arcade Build - DC Vs Marvel

vaportrail

@alturis said in Full Size Arcade Build - DC Vs Marvel:

I just had some experience with Zippyy joysticks vs Sanwa and I have to absolutely recommend you go with the Sanwa ones instead. The zippy sticks have way too much of a dead zone and are not as responsive as the sanwa. Durability aside the sanwa sticks just play better.

Sweet artwork!

Thanks for the advice, the only other ones I have used are the generic LED joysticks which are...well ok...I'll probably take your advice and upgrade to the Sanwas. What is your experience with buttons?

Alturis

Well, I have some new button switches arriving tomorrow that I can report back on. But I was also disappointed with how clicky and loud the button presses were as well as requiring too much down press to trigger the click and sometimes feeling too springy. Like you could press a button, it would trip the switch, and then you can feel and hear a spring twanging for a bit after.

I have a bunch of these arriving tomorrow to hopefully alleviate that.
http://groovygamegear.com/webstore/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=92&products_id=346

Clyde

@vaportrail I have Zippy joysticks in my to-be-finished-this-spring upright arcade build and I can't recommend them either. I've ordered two Mag-Stik Plus joysticks that center the stick with magnets rather than springs and can be switched between 8-way and 4-way by simply pulling the stick up and turning it. I can report about them here after they arrive, if you like.

@alturis I bear the same grudge against those loud and stiff microswitches. Thus, I would very much like to hear your review about the Soft-Touch switches.

Alturis

@vaportrail / @Clyde : They arrived today and I just got them installed. The first thing I did was play Galaga and I beat my old high score the first time by a good 30,000 points.
The buttons are much more responsive and you can rapid fire much more easily and quickly.

Still have some getting used to them to do but overall my initial reaction is that I LOVE them. Much better than the cheapo clicky switches.

The only possible downside thus far is that you really don't feel any click at all when you press the buttons which can leave you wondering if you clicked it at all. But thus far I have never hit a button and had it not register because I had not pressed it far enough. If anything I am worried that I will hit a button by accident just because my finger brushes up against it. But again this hasn't happened yet either. They are super responsive and sensitive.

Will take some getting used to but well worth the switch out I would say.

AndersHP

@clyde I'd love to hear about your Mag Sticks, the easy 4/8 way switching sounds really cool.
I'm using Sanwas, but the switching is a hassle, so basically alwas has it set to 8 way.

The joysticks themselves are great though.

FlyingTomahawk

Sanwa or Seimitsu nothing else.
Sanwa has been in the arcade business for..... long.
Seimitsu suppose to have better sticks for shoot em ups.

I have two custom build arcade sticks and I used an all Sanwa setup and a Seimitsu stick with Sanwa button setup. I would highly recommend you buy the Sanwa stuff. The only down side of Sanwa is they don't have illuminated buttons or sticks. Seimitsu has buttons that are but those are costly.
But then again who needs shiny buttons as long you can play better. ;-)

lilbud

Might I just say, Suzo Happ are also very good. I wanted to use Sanwa, but they wouldn't snap into my wooden control panel. Suzo buttons are very responsive in the 2 sticks I used.

FlyingTomahawk

@lilbud said in Full Size Arcade Build - DC Vs Marvel:

but they wouldn't snap

Not all buttons are snap in type. Seimitsu (PS-14-GN) and Sanwa (OBSN-30) have screw type buttons exactly for such cases.

vaportrail

@alturis
Haha well done on the new high score!

@Clyde
Absolutely would appreciate some feedback once you get some playtime on the new Joysticks

@FlyingTomahawk
I’m definitely leaning towards the Sanwa Joys, unfortunately my simple brain is attracted to shiny bright objects...so it might be tough going with non LED buttons! :)

@lilbud @FlyingTomahawk
I looked on Paradise and at least initially all I could find were the snap ins, I’ll have to go look again. I know on the Bartop the precut button holes were quite a bit bigger than the buttons I dropped in. So I would think because of the diameter of the hole and thickness of the MDF, they would have to be threaded. Looks like I have some measuring and learning to do!

lilbud

@vaportrail I get everything from this site: https://www.focusattack.com/

Also, I'd recommend screw in buttons. They might wake the neighbors but they are good quality.

barrymossel

These are very light as well: https://paradisearcadeshop.com/microswitches/36-rollie-leaf-switch-for-pushbutton.html

Clyde

@Alturis Thanks for the buttons review. Now I have to look for a vendor in Europe who delivers them to Germany. :)

@barrymossel Do you have first-hand experience with the leaf switches? If so, care to share them with us?

@FlyingTomahawk Why exactly are Seimitsu sticks supposed to be better for shoot em ups?

@alturis @vaportrail My first impressions of the Mag-Stik Plus:

Pros:

good, sturdy worksmanship
quick responses, very short actuation travel (If you like that.)
The 4/8-way switching by pulling the stick up and turning it works fine – if you reassemble the stick precisely (see below).
The connector pins are slightly smaller than those of my Zippyy sticks, making (dis-)connecting the wires less painful for my fingers. :)

Cons:

very short actuation travel (If you don't like that.)
Strong centering power that requires a certain strength to move the stick and may fatigue your hands after some time. The leverage of the relatively long bat top compensates for that to some extend, so it may just be a matter of playing technique. If that's your only gripe about the Mag-Stik, see these instructions to lessen the magnetic pull.
Shorter mounting plate than Zippyy (and Sanwa I think), that's incompatible with the holes in my control panel. I didn't know that these holes aren't standardised, now I do. :P For the time being, two of four screws hold the Mag-Stiks firmly enough, but I may have to purchase an adapter plate if I decide to keep them. You can see the exact dimensions in the mounting diagrams on the Ultimarc website.
If the joystick holes in your CP aren't big enough to let the ball top through, you'll have to dismantle the 4/8-way switching mechanism on the shaft and remove the shaft completely. The mounting diagrams also show the assembling order of all the parts.
At first, I seem to have made a miniscule discrepancy in reassembling the stick, resulting in unreliable way switching and occational unresponsiveness in certain directions. After dismantling and reassembling the stick once more, both issues seem to have disappeared. So, a certain minimum of manual skills and dilligence is advisable.

All in all, I can recommend the Mag-Stik Plus if you're aware of the issues above. I tested them in fighting games, shoot em ups, and labyrinth games (pac man etc.) In my web research about these sticks, I found this video that compares many common arcade joysticks including Zippyy, Sanwa and the Mag-Stik:

The reviewer notes that you might only need one Mag Stik Plus because 4-way games tend to have alternating 2-player modes that use only one stick for both players (except for cocktail cabinets). Its little sibling, the normal Mag-Stik without the Plus and "only" with a 4/8-way switch underneath its mounting plate is significantly cheaper and may suffice as the second joystick, as would any other 8-way joystick if you don't mind the more or less different design.

Having said all that, I also ordered two Sanwa JLF-TP-8YT-SK joysticks for comparison and as potential replacements for the built-in sticks of my two standalone Mayflash Arcade Fighting sticks. In a way, I have tasted blood in this matter. ;)

Alturis

@clyde said in Full Size Arcade Build - DC Vs Marvel:

I also ordered two Sanwa JLF-TP-8YT-SK

I got two of those as well. Then the clickiness of the stick actuation bugged me too. I highly recommend these upgrades :
https://paradisearcadeshop.com/levers-sanwa/1636-sanwa-jlf-tprg-8ayt-sk-silent-joystick-kit.html

Or for someone buying new sticks:
https://paradisearcadeshop.com/levers-sanwa/1456-sanwa-jlf-tprg-8ayt-sk-silent-joystick.html

Clyde

@alturis Yeah, I saw these too and watched a video that demonstrated their noise reduction. But their price doesn't fit the low level of annoyance the clicks pose to me. ;)

FlyingTomahawk

@clyde

Search google for "Sanwa vs Seimitsu sticks" or "JLF vs LS-32" and read the comments people give.
Most say that the Seimitsu is the stick to go for Schmups games. And the JLF stick is more for fighting games. True or not? Don't know, maybe more of a preference thing?

I own both and from my experience I can say the Seimitsu has smaller dead zones, is a bit stiffer, stick returns faster to center.
You can however modify any stick for example by adding stiffer springs inside.

I personally prefer my Seimitsu arcade stick for Schmups games and the Sanwa stick for fighting games.

Clyde

@flyingtomahawk Thanks, I'll soon see how the Sanwa positions itself between my Zippyy and Ultimarc sticks in that regard. Comparing the latter two, I can already see why people like to use stiffer sticks with smaller dead zones for fighting games.

FlyingTomahawk

@clyde

Please keep us updated on your findings.
Maybe in a separate topic? So that we can avoid cluttering up this topic here.
Would make for a nice conversation, the stick stuff I mean.

Clyde

@flyingtomahawk Good idea! Done.

BaviaanNL

Interesting reading your opinions of the Mag Stick Pro's.

I had 2 arrive today although haven't had a chance to install to my cab yet (job for tomorrow)

My first observation regarding the lift and twist mechanism to switch between 4 or 8 position is that the lift isn't necessary, I seem to be able to simply twist in order to achieve the task, is it the same with yours?

Not a massive issue as twisting the stick isn't necessary, just curious as to why the lift isn't necessary on these sticks.

Clyde

@baviaannl I replied to your question in my joystick thread that I linked above to avoid the off-topic talk here. I hope that's okay for you. O:)